Homer was a woman !!??

mr dalby?ms dalby probably

Originally posted by Arb�r Z Do you believe that there was a single author to the poems (Illiad and Odyssea)? Actually it is more probable that these were part of the oral traditon of the time (Like with the Gilghamesh Epic, scribes were writing down what they heard from some rhapsodes. This poems were sung, therefore we can coll them also "bards"). I really doubt that Homer (if he existed), created the poems. What is the importance of the sex of the author (if there is one author)? I ve read many claiming that Shakespeare was a woman, that Da Vinci was a gay etc etc. well, in my opinion the sexuality of a genial mind is not very important. But still, I am of the opinion that the author of the epic tales were the ancient greeks, and they cannot be referred as feminine or masculine.

I agree with you totally: they were part of oral tradition. They give us, not just the thoughts of any one author, but of a whole culture through several generations.

Now I can understand the argument that says "Therefore, the personality of the poet who got this material written down doesn't matter. It was already there, in the poetic tradition. There's no single personality involved!"

Yes, but my belief about oral tradition is that in reality each performance is different. The poet who finally made the two epics that were recorded in writing, was an astonishing genius, for these poems have been read and enjoyed, for nearly 3000 years, by many more people than almost any other written work. And the strange thing is that ancient Greek texts don't tell us anything about the occasion when these two poems were written down. That's the occasion that I tried to focus on. I wanted to find out more about it. I saw some evidence -- not conclusive, but persuasive -- that suggested to me that a woman (a member of a family of oral poets) might have been responsible. I won't tell you all my arguments here, but I began to feel that this explained some puzzles about the Iliad and Odyssey.

What's the importance of the sex of the poet? Again, a good question. Maybe of very little importance. Except that we always assume it was a man. I wanted to open the question up. Read this response by a classics professor --

'Anthony Snodgrass, emeritus professor of classical archaeology at Cambridge University, said The Odyssey could have been written by a woman because it is about "a world at peace in general terms, with domesticity, fidelity ... endurance and determination rather than aggression". 

But he added: "The idea of a woman writing The Iliad and not being bored out of her mind by the endless fighting and killings is a bit more far-fetched."'

So he thinks that half the world's population would be "bored out of her mind" by the Iliad? I hope I can make people who think like that, think again!

Originally posted by Arb�r Z [QUOTE=Pantagathus] Read the Illiad and the Oddyssey, then if you got time read Dalby, but I would advise you to wait a bit, time should pass before you read Dalby, if not you will not enjoy the poems.

I look forward to reading your book, Mr Dalby. And having not the object of your thesis for about 5~10 years, I am not really in a position to say anything. But, this question has to be asked, what makes you specifically think that it is a women? Are you just saying that "we should not presume that Homer was a man, she could be a women"? Or is it something that your training picked up?

Originally posted by Pantagathus   To paraphrase Mr. Dalby (liberally), it's probably best not to use that term in this case because 'Bard' specifically refers to a Celtic vagabond minstrel who sucked up to chieftains & heroes for a free meal.

Edited by Goban - 22-Jul-2006 at 09:02

Originally posted by Pantagathus Originally posted by Arb�r Z So in my opinion the Illiad and the Odyssey cannot be attributed to a single man (bard).   To paraphrase Mr. Dalby (liberally), it's probably best not to use that term in this case because 'Bard' specifically refers to a Celtic vagabond minstrel who sucked up to chieftains & heroes for a free meal.   If you love the epics then it is worth your while to read the book. If you disagree with the main hypothesis in the end, it doesn't mean that there is no new insight in the book to glean in regards to the mystery surrounding Homer.   I've only just begun the book but it seems clear to me that Mr. Dalby has done extensive research on the subject and is not just out to make an extra buck based on a tag line about Homer being a woman...

I have red the Illiad and the Odyssey several times, since I was a kid greek mythology, and eppical poems attracted me mre than anything. Now, it is true, Homer might have been only a bard, or only a scribe. It is very probable that he didnt create this tales. In my opinion the tales, the epics, always have to pass through an oral phase, which gives to simply narrated story the shape of a magnificent poem. So in my opinion the Illiad and the Odyssey cannot be attributed to a single man (bard). They were created orally from generation to the other, and from a bard to the other. It could be true, maybe some of the bards could have been women. But it is not likely. The poems are Warriors' Songs and Wandering Man's Songs. The poems imply a good knowledge of the military techniques, of the battle field, of the naval science etc. And the style, the shape, the colour of the words, the inside, in my opinion is very Virile and Heroic. It is strange to think about sexism, the songs are inspired by a (feminine) muse. Read the poems, and you 'll understand the virility of the many bards (narrators), as well as that of the protagonists.

Nuh,i think it's false and funny.

Originally posted by Maziar Komnenos welcome back from your WM trip.   I have a question, granted that Homer were a woman, what was the reason for the historians to tell us she was a man?

Kind of makes one wonder... where will the revisiosist "just for kicks and publicity" crap end? I mean everybody is trying to build reputation and (if lucky) a fortune, by screwing history in random ways...