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Kamikaze 738
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Topic: Thermopylae movie- "300" Posted: 17-Jul-2007 at 01:09 |
Originally posted by Dolphin
Plus 300 never claimed to be a factual representation of the past, despite the fact that the story isn't even fact in itself, just ossified legend. |
Are you saying the Battle of Thermopylae was just legend?!
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Zagros
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Posted: 15-Jul-2007 at 14:56 |
Not always - 28 weeks later was a blatant critiscism of the behaviour of troops in the occupation of Iraq, and highlighted the fact that sometimes the ally/saviour is quite indistinguishable from the enemy. This angle was manifestly there but didn't stop the enjoyment. |
That was a very astute observation, I couldn't see beyond the gore, guts and savagery in that movie! I have no problems with such artistic messages, what I object to is the servicing of political propaganda in movies.
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PanzerOberst
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Posted: 15-Jul-2007 at 14:16 |
Originally posted by Dolphin
Originally posted by PanzerOberst
Have to watch it (Alexander) again, don't quite recall the scene you mentioned. But overall I agree with you, it's spoils the movie when poltical agendas are blatantly inserted. |
Not always - 28 weeks later was a blatant critiscism of the behaviour of troops in the occupation of Iraq, and highlighted the fact that sometimes the ally/saviour is quite indistinguishable from the enemy. This angle was manifestly there but didn't stop the enjoyment..
Plus 300 never claimed to be a factual representation of the past, despite the fact that the story isn't even fact in itself, just ossified legend. Like come on, what next in films - talking toys? Dinosaurs and people? Hobbits?
I underststand that some people may see a film like this and confuse what 'happened' with what was depicted as happening..But that's their fault, not the fault of the filmmakers.The only film I can think of that went too far in terms of tampering with the facts was the J.F.K. film with Kevin Costner. That film's lies still has people convinced that Oswald didn't do it.
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Yup, that's quite true. For the uninitiated, they may confuse fact & fiction.
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Guests
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Posted: 14-Jul-2007 at 08:32 |
The movie was really good even though the movie was really inaccurate it was the intensidy of the movie that liked about it.
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Dolphin
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Posted: 06-Jul-2007 at 06:56 |
Originally posted by PanzerOberst
Have to watch it (Alexander) again, don't quite recall the scene you mentioned. But overall I agree with you, it's spoils the movie when poltical agendas are blatantly inserted. |
Not always - 28 weeks later was a blatant critiscism of the behaviour of troops in the occupation of Iraq, and highlighted the fact that sometimes the ally/saviour is quite indistinguishable from the enemy. This angle was manifestly there but didn't stop the enjoyment..
Plus 300 never claimed to be a factual representation of the past, despite the fact that the story isn't even fact in itself, just ossified legend. Like come on, what next in films - talking toys? Dinosaurs and people? Hobbits?
I underststand that some people may see a film like this and confuse what 'happened' with what was depicted as happening..But that's their fault, not the fault of the filmmakers.The only film I can think of that went too far in terms of tampering with the facts was the J.F.K. film with Kevin Costner. That film's lies still has people convinced that Oswald didn't do it.
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bagelofdoom
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Posted: 06-Jul-2007 at 06:01 |
I saw this movie several months after reading The Song of Roland, a 12th (I believe) century epic portrayal of one of Charlemagne's battles. It was a complete propoganda piece, meant to show the danger posed by the Muslims to Christian Europe. In it, Roland, fighting a doomed rear-guard action against a vastly superior force (as the result of a traitor in Charlemagne's court), fights not only the spanish muslims, but also africans, and arabs. Its an entertaining read, people get split in half lengthwise, just as 300 was an entertaining movie. However, I find it interesting that two works, separated by 800 years could be making the same exact point (the danger of islam (in 300 the association is assumed)) with the same exact imagery (evil arabs and blacks) with a very similar story (the outnumbered but noble defenders who are only weak numericaly as a result of treason). Its the exact same propoganda message, and it still works to this day. Now thats what I call an effective message.
Also: I remember reading that a comedian had said the movie was named 300 after how gay it was on a scale of one to ten. I agree with the poster that called them on going after Athenian "boy lovers" it was a hypocritical.
Edited by bagelofdoom - 06-Jul-2007 at 06:10
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PanzerOberst
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Posted: 21-Jun-2007 at 15:46 |
Have to watch it (Alexander) again, don't quite recall the scene you mentioned. But overall I agree with you, it's spoils the movie when poltical agendas are blatantly inserted.
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Kamikaze 738
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Posted: 18-Jun-2007 at 09:48 |
They did the same thing in the movie Alexander in which Ptolemy said that it was easier to enter Babylon than it is to leave, something related to how easy it was for US forces to enter Iraq but was difficult to leave due to increase insurgents and other violent affairs in Iraq. Sometimes these things are portrayed in movies and I think its quite stupid. Its a movie about Alexander or Leonidas not some freedom or Iraq. I dont really get what they are trying to do but sometimes it just ruins the movie...
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PanzerOberst
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Posted: 18-Jun-2007 at 02:58 |
Before watching it I knew that I would have to disregard some aspect of the film. But the thing that ticks me off is the part where they cry out "Freedom......" and all that crap, It stinks too much of Bushies propaganda. They might as well cast GWB for the role of Leonidas.....
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gcle2003
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Posted: 13-Apr-2007 at 09:34 |
Originally posted by malizai_
Can't wait for the fictional movie based on the comical adaptation of Mein Kampf. |
Check out Chaplin's The Great Dictator.
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Zagros
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Posted: 13-Apr-2007 at 09:33 |
Let's take things into context and look deeper into the author's psyche - when that is examined his motivations for criminally distorting history becomes so much clearer. He is one of these East vrs West freaks - a clash of cultures moron.
(National Public Radio NPR): Frank, whats the state of the union?
Frank Miller: Well. I dont really find myself worrying about the state of the union as I do the state of the home-front. It seems to me quite obvious that our country and the entire Western World is up against an existential foe that knows exactly what it wants and were behaving like a collapsing empire
NPR: A lot of people would say what America has done abroad has led to the doubts and even the hatred of its own citizens.
Frank Miller: Well, okay, then lets finally talk about the enemy. For some reason, nobody seems to be talking about who were up against, and the sixth century barbarism that they actually represent. These people saw peoples heads off. They enslave women, they genitally mutilate their daughters, they do not behave by any cultural norms that are sensible to us. Im speaking into a microphone that never could have been a product of their culture, and Im living in a city where three thousand of my neighbors were killed by thieves of airplanes they never could have built.
NPR: As you look at people around you, though, why do you think theyre so, as you would put it, self-absorbed, even whiny?
Frank Miller: Well, Id say its for the same reason the Athenians and Romans were. Weve got it a little good right now. Where I would fault President Bush the most, was that in the wake of 9/11, he motivated our military, but he didnt call the nation into a state of war
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What an extremist, and this comic was written well before 911.
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Eondt
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Posted: 13-Apr-2007 at 09:26 |
Now that everyone discussed the historical accuracy of the Graphic Novel "300", maybe we should discuss the historical accuracy of the X-men trilogy...
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Aelfgifu
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Posted: 13-Apr-2007 at 05:16 |
So, I did finally see it. I though visually it was absolutely stunning. On the other hand the one-liners were unbelievably bad... I'd say that next to 8 hours of abs training there seems to have been no time left for actinglessons... or learning lines... Not that it really matters... A (female) friend of mine told me she had honestly not noticed there even was a story at all, she was too busy staring at the physique of the actors...![Tongue](http://www.allempires.com/forum/smileys/smiley17.gif)
And I do not think the Persians came out worse neccesarily: How am I supposed to take serious a nation (the Spartans) who supposedly go to war dressed in little more than some very dodgy underwear... And a nation, at that, who keep paying lip service to freedom and all that even though their economy was in fact based on slave-labour... Not very nice at all. They did not have my sympathy, that's for sure.
The persians on the other hand were quite cool. AND they are the ones who were tolerant of everyone, including the ones that are not comform the norm. I mean, the Spartans killed babies that were not good enough... how sick is that?
And Xerxes was... well... (giggle)... funny. ![LOL](http://www.allempires.com/forum/smileys/smiley36.gif)
Oh, and I would like to add that I think any random watcher must be really really confused to draw a direct parralel between the Persians and the modern Iranians... I mean, come on... it is so obvious bullsh*t... It is a comic for crying out loud...
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Athanasios
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Posted: 12-Apr-2007 at 18:53 |
Hehe, in an interview ,in greek tv, the actor who plays Leonidas, didn't know that the hot-gates ![Shocked](smileys/smiley3.gif) was a real battle ![LOL](smileys/smiley36.gif) ...
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SearchAndDestroy
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Posted: 01-Apr-2007 at 17:20 |
Nice finds T.Ape, and I agree. I believe I mentioned in one of these threads that Americans wouldn't associate Persians with modern Iranians.
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Zagros
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Posted: 01-Apr-2007 at 15:40 |
Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa
Originally posted by Xshayathiya
Originally posted by Adalwolf
I don't see why there wouldn't have been some African troops in Xerxe's army. I mean, didn't Persia rule over 1000 over kingdoms? I would assume some of which would have been in Africa. |
The Persian empire did extend to Ethiopia, and it would not be unlikely that there'd be Africans in the army, but them making up a large portion of the army AND two emissaries would have been unlikely. |
Exactly the point I have been making in the 300 threads.
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Except for the fact that the Persian military was primarily comprised of Perisans, Medeans and Scythians/Bactrians! Ethiopian marines are noted, but as navy personnel on board Phoenecian and Carthaginian crewed ships.
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T. Ape
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Posted: 01-Apr-2007 at 14:36 |
I said this in the other thread, I will repost it here:
Here is the one problem I have with this whole theory: nobody in America knows that Persia and Iran are one and the same!
Last Friday, I went and randomly questioned some random 15 individuals who had seen this movie. My results were interesting:
7 of the 15 did not know that Thermopylae was a real battle.
Only 4 out of the 7 had any idea where Thermopylae was.
10 out of 15 could not tell you the area in which Persia is today.
15 out of 15 did not know that the Iranians are considered Persians. (Ethnically speaking.)
Here is the big whammy:
15 out of 15 did not take the movie as a serious history project.
In short, no one in America even thought about Iran until they heard about the uproar from the Iranians. To be truthful, most Americans consider Iran a tiny unimportant state that has the eternal goal of causing a crisis here and there so it can gain attention. Nobody, and I mean nobody, would ever associate a great and powerful ancient superpower (Persia) with Iran.
If anything, we would associate the Persians with the United States. Think about it. America is a Hyperpower, Persia was the Hyperpower of the ancient world. America has been annexing smaller states for no real reason, Persia did the same in the film. The Persians have a God-complex, well so do most Americans. And because we Americans have a problem with our country right now (in fact we Americans have a problem with pretty much everything right now) we would be happy to watch a political charged anti- American movie.
No, this film was the farthest from physiological warfare against the Iranians. In fact, the common perception of Iranians in the West- crazies who are always picking a fight over something -is only being heightened by the continued persecution of this film.
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Emperor Barbarossa
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Posted: 31-Mar-2007 at 18:30 |
Originally posted by Xshayathiya
Originally posted by Adalwolf
I don't see why there wouldn't have been some African troops in Xerxe's army. I mean, didn't Persia rule over 1000 over kingdoms? I would assume some of which would have been in Africa. |
The Persian empire did extend to Ethiopia, and it would not be unlikely that there'd be Africans in the army, but them making up a large portion of the army AND two emissaries would have been unlikely. |
Exactly the point I have been making in the 300 threads.
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Zagros
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Posted: 28-Mar-2007 at 15:26 |
Haha, I am sure you won't mind since you seem to have enjoyed it so much! It didn't show it here if it was at the beginning then. It's definitely a good thing that it did though.
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Adalwolf
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Posted: 28-Mar-2007 at 14:46 |
I thought it was at the beginning, but I don't remember, I saw it a few weeks ago, maybe I'll go see it again to find out for sure!
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