Ancient Korean Names

This post is exactly the same as the one I mistakenly put in another thread "Chinese Compound Surnames".

Originally posted by JiNanRen chech out this list of compound surnames http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_compound_surname

Thanks for the link. Very interesting.

Interestingly, some of those Chinese compound surnames can also be found in Korea.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Korean_family_names

e.g. Namgung, Dongbang, Dokgo, Sagong, Seomun, Jegal, Hwangbo.

However, there are a few distinctively non-Chinese compound surnames found in Korea. Some "look" Japanese

e.g. Gangjeon, Sobong, Janggok,

Some don't  (am I wrong about that?):

e.g. Mangjeol, Seonu, Eogeum

 

The following is an exerpt from a link on "Korean surname" on Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_surname

Historical names

Native names

Prior to the adoption of Chinese-style names, Koreans had indigenous names. They did not have family names, at least as part of personal names. Native given names were sometimes composed of three syllables like Misaheun (미사흔; δ˹��) and Sadaham (사다함; ˹�ຬ).

Under the strong influence of Chinese culture in the first millennium of the Common Era, Koreans adopted family names. Family names were limited to kings and aristocrats at the beginning, but gradually spread to the commoners during the Goryeo and Joseon periods.

Goguryeo in Manchuria and northern Korea and Baekje in southwestern Korea had many non-Chinese family names. They often consisted of two characters and many of them seem to have been toponyms. Judging from Japanese records, some characters were pronounced not by their Chinese reading but by their reading in the native language (see Hanja#Hun and Eum). For example, Goguryeo General Yeon Gaesomun (연개소문; �Y�w�K��) is called Iri Kasumi (��������) in Nihonshoki. Like cheon (천; Ȫ) in Chinese, iri would presumably have meant "fountain" in the Goguryeo language.

In contrast, Silla family names were totally Chinese-style ones, which is not likely related to King Muyeol's Sinicization policy.

The ancient kings of Korea gave their subjects family names. For example, in AD 33, King Yuri gave the tribes of Saro (Silla) names like Bae (배 ), Choe (최 ), Jeong (정 ), Son (손 ) and Seol (설 ). Other names given by kings are An (안 ), Cha (차 ), Han (한 ), Hong (홍 ), Kim (김 ), Kwon (권 ), Nam (남 ), Eo (어 ), and Wang (왕 ).

Mongolian names

Under the domination of the Mongol Empire during the Goryeo Dynasty, Korean kings and aristocrats had both Mongolian and Sino-Korean names. For example, King Gongmin had both the Mongolian name Bayan Tem��r (�����ľ��) and the Chinese-style name Wang Gi (����) (later renamed Wang Jeon ���).

Mongolian personal names did not include family names, so some Korean nobility had names that were combinations of Sino-Korean family names and Mongolian given names. For example, Ki Cheol (���H), a brother of the Qi Empress, was called Ki Bayan Bukha (�沮���) and the Qi Empress's eunuch was called Bak Bukha (�Ӳ���).

Japanization of names

During the period of Japanese colonial rule of Korea (1910�C1945), Koreans were in practice compelled to adopt Japanese-language names. In 1939, as part of Governor-General Jiro Minami's policy of cultural assimilation (ͬ������; d��ka seisaku) [1], Ordinance No. 20 (Commonly called the "Name Order") was issued, and went into law on February 11, 1940, the 2,600th anniversary of the mythical Emperor Jimmu's founding of Japan [2].

The ordinance �� commonly called S��shi-kaimei (���ϸ���) in Japanese �� allowed in theory (but compelled in practice) Koreans to adopt Japanese family and given names. Although the Japanese Government-General officially prohibited compulsion, low-level officials practically forced Koreans to get Japanese-style family names, and by 1944, approximately 84 percent of the population had registered Japanese family names (Nahm 1988, p. 233).

S��shi (Japanese) means the creation of a Japanese family name or si (Korean ssi (씨 ), distinct from a Korean family name or seong (Japanese sei). Japanese family names represent the families they belong to and can be changed by marriage and other procedures, while Korean family names represent paternal linkages and are unchangeable. S��shi represented a dual operation of both Japanese and Korean family name systems. Japanese policy dictated that Koreans either could register a completely new Japanese family name unrelated to their Korean surname, or have their Korean family name, in Japanese form, automatically become their Japanese name. Koreans were not, however, permitted to register a Korean family name other than their original name. For example, a person surnamed Bak (박; ��) would be permitted to register Arai (�¾�), a Japanese name, or Boku (the Japanese equivalent of Bak), but did not have the choice of taking the name Kim (김; ��).

Japanese conventions of creating given names also made their way into Korea, such as putting a character "��" (Japanese ko and Korean ja meaning "descendant" or "son") to make feminine names like "����" (Japanese Tamako and Korean Okja), although this practice is seldom seen in modern Korea, either North or South. (See External links for more on the S��shi-kaimei policy.)

After the Japanese defeat in World War II and the liberation of Korea, the Name Restoration Order (조선 성명 복구령; ���r�������f��) was issued on October 23, 1946 by the United States military administration south of the 38th parallel north, enabling Koreans to restore their Korean names if they wished to.

 

Korean surname Lee (or Rhee) is a mis-transcription of Yi.

In South Korea, it is always pronounced as "Yi", most of the times.

Originally posted by johannes i know that there are Chinese & Ryukyuan records that stated many families from Hokkien moved to Okinawa during the Ming & became prominent families there.

Do you have any sources that we can refer to?

Originally posted by johannes There is a GREAT (& academically ACCURATE) site on Japanese naming tradition, both archaic & modern, written by a historical role-player (what do you call them?  Re-enactors or something..) but i can't find it yet

What a shame!

Um, i think it's the other way around....

It's LEE/ LI/ LY in Chinese/Vietnamese,

is realized as [r] at the start of a syllable in Korean, so Lee/Li is sometimes romanized as Rhee/Ri/Ree as well.

but the Korean language also drops the [r] sound in front of or it becomes [y] before [eo] [e]  [o] vowels, while it turns into [n] before the [a] & [ae] vowels, so LEE is now pronounced as YEE/ YI in modern Korean.  

Chinese [LONG] "dragon" --> Korean [YONG] 

Chinese surname [LIU] "willow" --> [YU]

i think some Korean dialects, i forgot, either far up north in North Korea or down south near Cheju, retain the intial [r]

Edited by johannes

It's interesting to note that 90% of Koreans & Vietnamese now have CHINESE-style given names, and what's more astonishing is that 90% have CHINESE Last names.

Of course there are more Kims & Parks in Korea, & Nguyens & Phams in Vietnam, but those last names exist among the Chinese as well.

And sure enough, there are Lees everywhere, because everyone in the Chinese cultural sphere during the Tang wanted to have the royal family's last name~!! 

i have a Korean friend whose name is kkotnim.  As in Miss (honorable)Flower.  Yeah, pretty wicked.  And another whose name was Ara.  Her last name was Cho.  Together, it sounded like CHO(h)ARA. "Good!"

Maybe a revival of native names are happening in both countries for given names.  i think that's pretty cool, but i don't think any family would start a counter-cultural-revolutionary & throw away centuries of Chinese cultural conditioning & start calling themselves with a pure Vietnamese or Korean clan name!

Johannes, the second site you recommended  is not currently available.

I came across an interesting information that maybe you could verify (it seems you have training in linguistics). On the Wikipedia link on Ryuku names, it's mentioned that the name "Kaneshiro" (the family name of the half-Japanese half-Taiwanese lead actor of the film "House of Flying Daggers") may in fact be of CHINESE origin. I know there are a few bisyllabic Chinese surnames, but is "Kaneshiro" (in its Chinese form of course) one of them?

Originally posted by King Kang of Lemuria For example, if I saw 'Beijing' written in Chinese letters, I would know it means 'Northern Capitol' just by looking at it, but I would say, 'Book Ghyoung' in Korean pronunciation.  Actually, is 'Beijing' an authentic pronunciation or Anglroidfied?  I've heard 'Peking' also, is 'Beijing' a Mandarin, 'Peking' a Cantonese?  Just wondering.

"Beijing" is quite authentic & official romanized, from the Putonghua/Mandarin pronunciation of [bei] [jing].

Modern Cantonese is [bAk] [ging], similar to English "buck" "ging" (hard 'g' as in girl)... well actually it's not anything like English or [g] but an unaspirated Spanish/French/Italian

& [k].

"Peking" could have been transcribed from any old dialect, but most probably a southern one, Cantonese or Hokkien, since it's [king] & not [jing]

Actually, even in early Mandarin, the [ki-] had not been palatalized into a [dji] sound yet, looking at old Portuguese/Chinese dictionaries, so "Peking" might just even be a transcription of an older Mandarin pronunciation.

 

Edited by johannes

they probably did sound different from how they were written

i.e. Japanese records write "YunGaeSoMun" as "Irigasumi" and it's probably closer to the actual Korean pronounciation..

Edited by I/eye

Originally posted by jamesse Hey, but we should take note that those names were recorded with Chinese Characters and Sino-Korean words might have changed over time. We don't even know if the Chinese words were compatible with Korean phonetics, so there's a high probability that those names are not how it sounded back then.

That's true. Phonetics change over time, so there's a great chance that what we read as say "Sadaham" wasn't actually pronounced as "Sadaham"

All three kingdoms had Idu style systems where different Chinese characters were used to portray syllables.  Kind of like Japan's syllabary.

Hey, but we should take note that those names were recorded with Chinese Characters and Sino-Korean words might have changed over time.

We don't even know if the Chinese words were compatible with Korean phonetics, so there's a high probability that those names are not how it sounded back then.