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Reginmund
Arch Duke
Joined: 08-May-2005
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Topic: Your best medieval army? Posted: 14-Jul-2005 at 14:26 |
Originally posted by maersk
the only reason why otto won at letchfeld was because the magyars where trapped by a river and couldent use their mobility |
In other words; for once they were forced to fight like men, and lost.
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Byzantine Emperor
Arch Duke
Kastrophylax kai Tzaousios
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Location: United States
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Posted: 14-Jul-2005 at 15:22 |
Here is my army, what might have been found in Basil II's reign in the Byzantine Empire, 10th century AD:
CAVALRY
2,000 Heavily armored Cataphracts and Clibanophoroi: Cataphracts armed with lances and swords as a secondary weapon, with chain mail armor for rider and horse. Clibanophoroi armed with maces, with breastplates and chain mail for both rider and horse. Clibs. also have characteristic Sassanian gold face armor.
3,000 Lightly armed cavalry: Mounted bowmen with eastern-style steppe bows and swords, light chainmail armor.
INFANTRY:
3,000 Mercenary and Thematic infantry: Arab infantry with light chain mail, scimitars; Bulgarian infantry with light chain mail and swords, axes; Thematic infatry similarly armed
500 heavily armed Varangian Guardsmen: Mostly Sicilian Norman and Saxon, armed with axes and straight swords, with heavy metal scale armor and tall triangular shields
1,500 archers: lightly armored with curved bows or throwing spears
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Temujin
King
Sirdar Bahadur
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Location: Eurasia
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Posted: 15-Jul-2005 at 18:15 |
Originally posted by maersk
the only reason why otto won at letchfeld was because the magyars where trapped by a river and couldent use their mobility |
if so, then why did the Magyars lost the battle of Riade...?
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Guests
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Posted: 15-Jul-2005 at 19:18 |
well, it depends who are u gonna fight.
If I was going against a european nation,
5000 man at arms (well trained and discipline)
500 crossbowmen 500archers
3000 heavy calvary and other thousand skirmish horses.
If going against Turks, believe it or not, heavy knights should me numberous like 5000 and attack in waves light fast moving infantry that would be able to strike after calvary and then keep pounding turkihs infantry from sides with more and more kights. Turkish spahi would destroy european infantry very quickly () So make sure the battle does not last long. the only way Serbs/Bosnian nad Hungarian medieval armies ever won a battle against discipline turks is when calvary charged the (flags) Generals and capitan's units and scared em away. Heavy calvary is useful in Europe where battlefileds are not huge and flat. thunderous charge form the hill with enemy not being able to spread too much, now middle east is a different game.
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Ikki
Chieftain
Guanarteme
Joined: 31-Dec-2004
Location: Spain
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Posted: 29-Jul-2005 at 20:22 |
I like the crusader army of Arsuf, it was effective against turks or
other christian. The crossbowmen protected by pavises and the men at
arms, the cavalry hope his oportunity and attacking supported by
infantry; crossbowmen and not archers because i prefer the power of the
crossbow. But i will add two typical warriors of Spain: almugavars and
jinetes, a flexible and fast weapon for a heavy army, very well against
both enemies.
Right:
3000 crossbowen
3000 men at arms
1000 almugavars
1000 jinetes
2000 heavy cavalry
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Nagyfejedelem
Baron
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Posted: 22-Aug-2005 at 05:45 |
My bests are the Hungarian horsemen from 10th century. They attacked and defeated every countries of Europe except Scandinavia and the British isles. They were called the horsemen of Apocalypse, however they had only tipical nomad technics and tactics. They usually destroyed quite bigger armies and visited twice the Atlantic ocean, owerwrote achievement of Attila.
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Quetzalcoatl
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Posted: 22-Aug-2005 at 21:37 |
10,000 heavily armoured infantry with large shield and throwing javelin and a long sword. Deployed in regiments just behind the crossbowmen and bombards
10, 000 heavy cavalry. Flank and screen
10,000 crossbowmen and hand canoneers . Infront of infantry operate with large wooden about 3 m high with apertures (especially when fighting agains range units and during a siege)
50 bombards (a crew of about 500), 5 giant trebuchet (100 operators each) for siege.Somewhere among the crossbowmen but also protected by wooden shield. Rapidly retreated behind infantry if the enemy charge them.
2,000 pikemen heavily armoured. protection for the crossbowmen against cavalry.
300 light cavalry (scouts)
20,000 peasants and 13,000 mules on logistics (carrying stones for trebuchets and bombards), food etc. But we will raid the enemy and live on the land mostly.
Me and my 99 elite heavy cavalry. Black armour, Black horse all, black cape, black flag with a rooster in red on it. Only me with a golden fleur-de-lys on my cape. I'm the duke of the Normandy or Burgundy.
Edited by Quetzalcoatl
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Emperor Barbarossa
Caliph
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Posted: 22-Aug-2005 at 21:59 |
I would take an army of five thousand infantry, two and a half thousand
cavalry, and two and a half thousand ranged men. I would want one
thousand Arabian Infantry with chainmail and scimitars and four
thousand heavily armored Europeans with swords. I would take half of my
cavalry heavy Teutonic Cavalry armed with Halberds, Sabres,
Breastplates, and chainmail. My other cavalry would by Arabian camels
armed with throwing spears, lances, and scimitars. I would want English
Longbowmen, French Crossbowmen, and Mongolian archers for my ranged
troops.
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Nagyfejedelem
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Location: Hungary
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Posted: 24-Aug-2005 at 09:28 |
Hungarian horsemen were the best!
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Maju
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Posted: 24-Aug-2005 at 10:13 |
Originally posted by Nagyfejedelem
My bests are the Hungarian
horsemen from 10th century. They attacked and defeated every countries
of Europe except Scandinavia and the British isles.
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Aren't you a little exaggerated? They never reached Spain nor I think they battled in France either...
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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Maju
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Posted: 24-Aug-2005 at 10:25 |
Originally posted by Ikki
I like the crusader army of Arsuf, it was effective against turks or
other christian. The crossbowmen protected by pavises and the men at
arms, the cavalry hope his oportunity and attacking supported by
infantry; crossbowmen and not archers because i prefer the power of the
crossbow. But i will add two typical warriors of Spain: almugavars and
jinetes, a flexible and fast weapon for a heavy army, very well against
both enemies.
Right:
3000 crossbowen
3000 men at arms
1000 almugavars
1000 jinetes
2000 heavy cavalry
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I like the idea of almogavares, it seems that they were able to
annihilate the heaviest of cavalries by the simple method of ripping
their horses' bellies and then engaging the dismounted knights in
one-to-one combat.
But what exactly do you mean by jinetes? That word translates as horse-rider, so I guess it's just some sort of light cavalry.
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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Nagyfejedelem
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Location: Hungary
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Posted: 24-Aug-2005 at 13:59 |
Maju:
I'm a bit nacionalist, but they were in Spain in 942.
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Maju
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Posted: 24-Aug-2005 at 15:23 |
Originally posted by Nagyfejedelem
Maju:
I'm a bit nacionalist, but they were in Spain in 942. |
First time I read something of the like. Where is the deep disbelief emoticon?
I would know if that was true. Where in Spain?, who they fought
against?, how did they reach there?, what villages did they sack?
Magyar pillages (nothing to be proud of, by the way) were
infamous but, while they sacked most of Germany and Northern Italy, and
I could concede they reached France out of insecurity, I'm pretty sure
they never went farther.
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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Nagyfejedelem
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Posted: 25-Aug-2005 at 03:18 |
The Hungarian warriors were incredible fast in this time. The Hungarian light cavalries were faster than other armies and every warriors had more than one horses. Only one problem was finding food for men and horses.
In 942 they attacked the Eastern parts of Spain, for example Barcelona and Lerida and they reached River Tajo. Magyars fought against Arabs and captured Arab captains. After that they went home.
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Nagyfejedelem
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Posted: 25-Aug-2005 at 03:24 |
Hungarians attacked Pelopponesos (South Greece), Apulia (South Italy) and Danmark, too.
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Raider
General
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Location: Hungary
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Posted: 25-Aug-2005 at 03:27 |
Maju:
Nagyfejedelem is right. Magyar raiders reached Spain too. There are written sources mention this campaign. One of the arab caliphs (I can't remember his name.) remarked that all of Hungarian people should be exterminated.
I will look after details for you.
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Nagyfejedelem
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Posted: 25-Aug-2005 at 05:06 |
Raider:
During the invasion in 942 the caliph was Abd ar-Rahman.
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Maju
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Posted: 25-Aug-2005 at 07:31 |
Originally posted by Raider
Maju:
Nagyfejedelem is right. Magyar raiders reached Spain too. There are
written sources mention this campaign. One of the arab caliphs (I can't
remember his name.) remarked that all of Hungarian people should be
exterminated. |
He surely was right
Seriously, Magyar raids are considered among the most criminal of
all times: killing all males and also women too old or too young,
carrying the rest of women as cattle. Vikings and even Atilla were true
delicate gentlement when compared.
Luckily, after Lech, your ancestors decided to change habits and settled down.
I will look after details for you. |
Yes please. It's an absolutely unknown episode of Iberian history.
Viking raids are rather well known but it's the first time I heard of
Hungarians in Iberia at all.
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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Nagyfejedelem
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Posted: 25-Aug-2005 at 08:20 |
Maju:
About Hungarian criminals: weren't true. Hungarians weren't as cruel as European warriors in this time. An Arab writer wrote about Hungarians cured their captured hurt enemies. Captured soldiers and civils weren't killed, usually were given back for money or were sold to Byzantium or Arabs.
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Nagyfejedelem
Baron
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Posted: 25-Aug-2005 at 08:36 |
Maju:
Most of the Hungarians settled down before Lechfeld.
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