Notice: This is the official website of the All Empires History Community (Reg. 10 Feb 2002)

  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Iranian influences on Arabic
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <123>
Author
  Share Topic Share Topic  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
azimuth View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar
SlaYer'S SlaYer

Joined: 12-Dec-2004
Location: Neutral Zone
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2979 		  Quote azimuth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Iranian influences on Arabic
    Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:41

Aryan Khadem you are wellcome to share what you have with us and we are thankfull for that.

but if what you posted already from a site i think its easier for you to give us the link for it.

and if it is from your personal colletion which is not available on the Web or personal site or anything like that then keep posting.
Back to Top
ramin View Drop Down
General
General


Joined: 16-Feb-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 921 		  Quote ramin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:42
Originally posted by Seko

Do you know of any particular Iranian words that are used in Arabic as well?
I believe gathered some list, with references hopefully. while I find them you can check this thread: http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2804
"I won't laugh if a philosophy halves the moon"
Back to Top
Aryan Khadem View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian


Joined: 09-Oct-2005
Location: New Zealand
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 170 		  Quote Aryan Khadem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:42

I do not deny Arabic Influence on Iran, Islam being the prime example. but remember that one of the first people to find Muhammad was an Iranian. Also what is mislead by the west is the Iranian influence on the Greeks which is vast. The fact of the matter is Iran has influenced and has also been touched by every religion in the world.

Shia Islam is an Iranianized form of islam, even though they have the Quran they do not put as much emphasis in the Hadith, alot of Shia Islam has parells in Zoroasterin or Zathushtism.
Life is beautiful but I am darker then Life.

Iran Aziz Janam Fadayt

ShahanShah
Back to Top
Seko View Drop Down
Emperor
Emperor
Avatar
Spammer

Joined: 01-Sep-2004
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 8595 		  Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:45

Originally posted by ramin

Originally posted by Seko

Do you know of any particular Iranian words that are used in Arabic as well?
I believe gathered some list, with references hopefully. while I find them you can check this thread: http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2804

Thanks for digging that up. I'll spend some time reading it soon.
Back to Top
ramin View Drop Down
General
General


Joined: 16-Feb-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 921 		  Quote ramin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:46
Originally posted by Seko

By the way, by saying that Arabic was forced upon the Iranian world seems hard to imagine.
I don't believe it was forced. According to my undestandings, Iranians kept Zoroastrian and their religious costumes and names until the very end of Arab rule, in spite of being illegal. Followeing independece of Iran from Arab rulers, Iranian caliphs made their peasant and subjected people to convert in order to please their Arab neighbors and to prevent paying possible tax money, and possible wars.
"I won't laugh if a philosophy halves the moon"
Back to Top
azimuth View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar
SlaYer'S SlaYer

Joined: 12-Dec-2004
Location: Neutral Zone
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2979 		  Quote azimuth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:46

Originally posted by ramin

Originally posted by Seko

Do you know of any particular Iranian words that are used in Arabic as well?
I believe gathered some list, with references hopefully. while I find them you can check this thread: http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2804

oh ramin  

i'll see what i can do to find the  roots of these words.

by the way i already showed you that Din has a different root in Arabic than the Iranian one.

and Aryan Khadem

tell me how the Word Arab is persian?!

 
Back to Top
Aryan Khadem View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian


Joined: 09-Oct-2005
Location: New Zealand
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 170 		  Quote Aryan Khadem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:47

SOme examples are given, I can gather more. I wanted to present this, so as to get people to read before commenting, some people do not go to websites and make comments. I do not Plagarise so I present what I read, I have my own essays I have done which I post on other parts of this website, ie origins of wine, goats etc....

 

This is in no way an attack on Arab culture, Arabic happens to be the most complete language in the world.
Life is beautiful but I am darker then Life.

Iran Aziz Janam Fadayt

ShahanShah
Back to Top
ramin View Drop Down
General
General


Joined: 16-Feb-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 921 		  Quote ramin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:50
Originally posted by azimuth

i'll see what i can do to find the  roots of these words.

by the way i already showed you that Din has a different root in Arabic than the Iranian one.

will appreciate it.

Originally posted by azimuth


and Aryan Khadem

tell me how the Word Arab is persian?!

I didn't read through his posts, but that would be pure absurd.
"I won't laugh if a philosophy halves the moon"
Back to Top
ramin View Drop Down
General
General


Joined: 16-Feb-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 921 		  Quote ramin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:51
Originally posted by Aryan Khadem

Arabic happens to be the most complete language in the world.
in what sense?
"I won't laugh if a philosophy halves the moon"
Back to Top
ramin View Drop Down
General
General


Joined: 16-Feb-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 921 		  Quote ramin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:55
Originally posted by Aryan Khadem

I have my own essays I have done which I post on other parts of this website, ie origins of wine, goats etc....
origin of wine? and Origin of Goat?! aren't we talking about something else?
"I won't laugh if a philosophy halves the moon"
Back to Top
Moustafa Pasha View Drop Down
Samurai
Samurai
Avatar

Joined: 19-Jun-2005
Location: Canada
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 133 		  Quote Moustafa Pasha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:58

From the above discussions that  Iranian words were introduced in the Arabic language,I strongly believe the opposite is true. A lot of Arabic words are part of the Iranian language starting from the moslem conquest and are still part of that language until today.

http://www.artarena.force9.co.uk/arab.html

http://crl.nmsu.edu/Research/Projects/shiraz/ling/introducti on.html



Edited by Moustafa Pasha
Back to Top
Aryan Khadem View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian


Joined: 09-Oct-2005
Location: New Zealand
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 170 		  Quote Aryan Khadem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 21:58

http://www.iranchamber.com/literature/articles/history_liter ature.php

http://www.iranchamber.com/history/islamic_conquest/islamic_ conquest.php

http://www.iranchamber.com/scripts/avestan_alphabet.php

http://www.languages.umd.edu/persian/persianlanguage3.php

And I am sorry I cannot find my source about the word Arab, so I am wrong for this I apologise here is a link explaining the words root.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab

 
Life is beautiful but I am darker then Life.

Iran Aziz Janam Fadayt

ShahanShah
Back to Top
ramin View Drop Down
General
General


Joined: 16-Feb-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 921 		  Quote ramin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 22:04
Originally posted by Moustafa Pasha

From the above discussions that  Iranian words were introduced in the Arabic language,I strongly believe the opposite is true. A lot of Arabic words are part of the Iranian language starting from the moslem conquest and are still part of that language until today.
well acturally both ways are true.
"I won't laugh if a philosophy halves the moon"
Back to Top
Aryan Khadem View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian


Joined: 09-Oct-2005
Location: New Zealand
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 170 		  Quote Aryan Khadem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 22:11
Sorry my research in Domestication and migration is different then the topic I opened. I do not deny influence of Arabic on Farsi, but the one that is denied even by Azimuth is Iranian on Arabic, yes Armaic was used in the Perisan Empire but was only spoken by nobles and the educated. What I do not get is why Arabs believe the exchange is only one way. People living near each other exchange ideas, culture and influence each other in ways. To say that there was no influence on Arabic Language by Iranian Languages is denial in the worst way. As scholars we should be open to possiblities and not be one tracked minded in our thinking.
Life is beautiful but I am darker then Life.

Iran Aziz Janam Fadayt

ShahanShah
Back to Top
Aryan Khadem View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian


Joined: 09-Oct-2005
Location: New Zealand
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 170 		  Quote Aryan Khadem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 22:22

Each of these letters is ordered in the dictionary immediately after the Arabic letter it is modified from.

There are eight Arabic letters that are used only in the spelling of Arabic loanwords. These are the six so-called guttural consonants and the two interdental fricatives:. None of these letters are pronounced the way they are in Arabic. This actually makes pronunciation of Persian much easier than pronunciation of Arabic. Each of these sounds is pronounced the same was an already existing Persian sound in the following way:

 
Life is beautiful but I am darker then Life.

Iran Aziz Janam Fadayt

ShahanShah
Back to Top
Aryan Khadem View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian


Joined: 09-Oct-2005
Location: New Zealand
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 170 		  Quote Aryan Khadem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 22:27

A government truly worthy of the name must be in accord with religion, in perfect union with it, is a Moslem maxim. This idea did not come from a Moslem legislator but is outlined in a Pahlavi book The Dinkard. The idea of Theocracy and undoubtedly the Khilaafat thus are Zarathushtrian influences. Also, Sufism, the salt of the Islamic world is also a product of the Persian Zarathushtrian spirit. Apart from the mention of Darius and Cyrus as Zulqarnian, amongst the brotherhood of Prophets, the Koran has very little mention of the Zarathushtrian faith. It may be justified in saying that the Prophet received but little direct influence from Zarathushtrianism.

Yet the influence was more prevalent in its cultural sphere. One of the associates of Prophet Mohammed was a Zarathushtrian High priest, Dastur Dinyar. His name was later changed to Salman-al-Farsee. He was regarded by the Prophet as Ahal-al-Bait, meaning of the family of the prophet, that is, a member of his spiritual circle. He had widely traveled in Syria, Mesopotamia and had a profound knowledge of Judaism, Christianity besides Zarathushtrianism. It is highly probable that Prophet Mohammed was influenced by Zarathushtrianism through him.
Life is beautiful but I am darker then Life.

Iran Aziz Janam Fadayt

ShahanShah
Back to Top
Aryan Khadem View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian


Joined: 09-Oct-2005
Location: New Zealand
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 170 		  Quote Aryan Khadem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 22:29

sorry forgot to leave the source of the last post, was written by Kayomarsh P. Mehta
Life is beautiful but I am darker then Life.

Iran Aziz Janam Fadayt

ShahanShah
Back to Top
Aryan Khadem View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian


Joined: 09-Oct-2005
Location: New Zealand
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 170 		  Quote Aryan Khadem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 22:31

And another of Iranian influences on Islamic buildings, which dominate the Arab world

http://www.cais-soas.com/CAIS/Architecture/sasanian_palaces_ islam.htm
Life is beautiful but I am darker then Life.

Iran Aziz Janam Fadayt

ShahanShah
Back to Top
ramin View Drop Down
General
General


Joined: 16-Feb-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 921 		  Quote ramin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 22:50
nobody denies the architectural manipulation of Iran in Islamic constructions...gotta go now
"I won't laugh if a philosophy halves the moon"
Back to Top
Aryan Khadem View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian


Joined: 09-Oct-2005
Location: New Zealand
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 170 		  Quote Aryan Khadem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Oct-2005 at 23:51

No but I bet Azimuth will deny it, he seems really content ot claiming everything to be originally arabic with no Iranian influences what so ever regardless of much archaeological works..... We know a word is introduced by the arrival of peoples, ie in Summerian they use Zu-Ab Ab being introduced by Iranians, and Iranians get Shah, from Sumerian and Babylonian Sar, it became Shah in Iranian and Czar in Russian!!!
Life is beautiful but I am darker then Life.

Iran Aziz Janam Fadayt

ShahanShah
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <123>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.56a [Free Express Edition]
Copyright ©2001-2009 Web Wiz

This page was generated in 0.094 seconds.