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Afghanistan, residential area or a Battle Field

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Gharanai View Drop Down
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  Quote Gharanai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Afghanistan, residential area or a Battle Field
    Posted: 11-Apr-2006 at 14:59

I was thinking about this since a long time, I wanted to know is Afghanistan really a place for living or just a battle field of nations who try to check if there army is still capable of fighting. I mean come on man Alexender, The British, Russians, Americans (Rather saying Multi nations) and don't know still how much more to come.

Nations do invade Afghanistan and then say that they are invited. Dam invitation. But I don't know what do they tell there nation once they are defeated. I ment what did the British and Russians told their nation about the lost of those worthfull lifes which were lost.

I really fell sorry for soldiers who die for a purpose they even don't know about...

Therefore, I wanted to know from you people what do you think about it and how do you come up with it ???
Shalln't Afghanistan just be named "Afghanistan: The Battle Field of the World" or shall it be "Afghanistan: Where people like all others live" ???



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  Quote Spartakus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Apr-2006 at 15:02
Right now,it's just steep mountains."The Battlefield of the world" should be given to the Balkans.
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  Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Apr-2006 at 17:11
Both? "The poppy plantation of the world"? How do you think the situation can be overcome? Expulsion of all foreigners? Integration in a hypothetical SouthAsia economic block?

Right now Afghanistan is still an occupied country and, like Iraq, nobody knows what would happen if the occupation forces leave... or even if they  stay.

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  Quote Gharanai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Apr-2006 at 17:40

I agree with you Maju, no one knows what could happen if the forces leave or stay.
But one thing is for sure if the forces are here there would be unrest in between people and there would be attacks going on, if they leave maybe we see a recap of what happend in 1992-1994 (The Civil War).

It's just a confussed situation, but at the end one thing is for sure that this occupation will end one day as well as others did, But what then ???

Oh man it makes me sick when I think about the future, that's why I say it should be just labeled as a battlefield let everyone in it die and then every invader may enjoy no resistance otherwise till there is one Afghan, there would be resistance, and that's for sure...



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  Quote Mila Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Apr-2006 at 17:52
'Everything works out in the end and if things aren't okay, it's not
the end.'

Probably more ominous than comforting, I suppose - but I'm
sure Afghanistan will recover. God help the country of any
strategic importance to the world's powers. And God help the
country that's not as well.

At least if you're in Iraq or Afghanistan you know someone's
going to feed you. You won't be as completely f--ked as
countries like Rwanda.
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  Quote Apples n Oranges Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Apr-2006 at 18:18

I guess the problems of Modern Afghanistan are:

1]Decades of war have left it one of the poorest countries in the whole world.

2]Lack of a stable and powerful central government which makes the complex ethnic mix even more problematic.

3]Lack of a seaport which leads to Afghanistan's dependence on Iran and Pakistan for foreign trade.

4]Afghanistan's strategic position.

Keeping in mind the 'War on Terrorism' is still on and there are vast reserves of Oil and Gas in Central Asia.......Foreign forces arn't going to leave Afghanistan anytime soon.

As far as the future is concerned...it's upto the people of Afghanistan.It all depends on how well different ethnicities are able to come together and form a modern nation from the ruins of an old one.

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  Quote Gharanai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Apr-2006 at 18:23

Hey dear Mila,
I am sure you didn't mean this sort of feeding!!!



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  Quote Apples n Oranges Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Apr-2006 at 18:34

..........

So how is the relationship between different ethnic groups at govt. level dear Gharanai.Do they still fight over representation in cabinet.I guess there have been some assasination attempts on ministers in central govt. ,are they related to power struggle between different ethnic groups.

What role are the foreign powers playing in developing the infrastructure in Afghanistan.

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  Quote Gharanai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Apr-2006 at 19:04
Originally posted by Apples n Oranges

..........

So how is the relationship between different ethnic groups at govt. level dear Gharanai.Do they still fight over representation in cabinet.I guess there have been some assasination attempts on ministers in central govt. ,are they related to power struggle between different ethnic groups.

What role are the foreign powers playing in developing the infrastructure in Afghanistan.

First of all I guess you are new to this forum (as it's first time talking to you), so most welcome and wish you have a very nice time around afterwards dear Apples n Oranges (oh you don't know how much do I like oranges ),

You have got some very nice points to talk about.
The relations between the ethnic groups are still not that fine, I personally don't know when all of Afghans will realize that these ethnical fightings are nothing else but a plot of foreigners who say "Divide and Rule". The fights are still going on for the seats of cabinet but this time rather in a formal way (they call it democratic way hahah), and those attacks are supposed to be from the people who don't want the process to proceed or it maybe from ethnic oppositions or even maybe from the attacked person himself to gain some popularity around but any way those attacks are not as dangerous as they used to be in 1990s.

And the power struggle is still going on each and every ethnic group wants to have a rather bigger piece of the cake, and the interesting part is that this time the smallest communities like Iemaq, Nuristani and others are also demanding. I guess this is democracy so let it be...

 



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  Quote Apples n Oranges Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Apr-2006 at 19:19

Thanx for the reply Dear Gharanai.You left my second question unanswered.I would like to know about the progress made in the field of education specially.

I like both Apples and Oranges [how many varieties of citrus fruits do you have in Afghanistan].

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  Quote edgewaters Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Apr-2006 at 08:35
Afghanistan has had times of prosperity and peace. Hopefully it will have them again soon. I have more hope for Afghanistan than I do for Iraq.

Edited by edgewaters
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  Quote Gharanai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Apr-2006 at 12:24
Originally posted by Apples n Oranges

Thanx for the reply Dear Gharanai.You left my second question unanswered.I would like to know about the progress made in the field of education specially.

I like both Apples and Oranges [how many varieties of citrus fruits do you have in Afghanistan].

Any time dear, there is no problem at all.
Well the process of rebuilding and re-establishment in Afghanistan is going on at a good pace but it's limited to certain areas for example Kabul. As far as education is concerned well, I myself am working as a volunteer with an NGO which is providing basic educational infrastructure and materials to Afghanistan. Well the only thing which has got better since Taleban in real means is the standard of Education and its availability all over the country, the foriegn countries (specially Japan) are really working hard in this field, that's for sure.

Well we do have something around 4-5 types of citrus around, but I bet you will never ever taste a better Apple all around the world than the Apples of Maidan Wardak province. They really taste amazing, along it the Pomegranate (Anaar) of Kandahar Province (one of my favorite) is also populer all over the place...

Any way back to the topic, if there is any other question still, you are most welcome to post it.



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  Quote Gharanai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Apr-2006 at 12:36

Originally posted by edgewaters

Afghanistan has had times of prosperity and peace. Hopefully it will have them again soon. I have more hope for Afghanistan than I do for Iraq.

Thanks alot dear for your cordial wishes, and you are right we did have some time of peace and prosperity and that was when both of the super powers (Russia and USA) recently had finished the WWII and were in process of re-establishing there bases... Those times were very sweat (I have just heard it from my grand parents, haven't seen peace my entire life).

Any way we too are willing to finish the long war and have some time to rest and build our country as others do, educate our childern as others do and have human rights as others do...



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  Quote Apples n Oranges Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Apr-2006 at 15:50
Originally posted by Gharanai

Well the process of rebuilding and re-establishment in Afghanistan is going on at a good pace but it's limited to certain areas for example Kabul. As far as education is concerned well, I myself am working as a volunteer with an NGO which is providing basic educational infrastructure and materials to Afghanistan. Well the only thing which has got better since Taleban in real means is the standard of Education and its availability all over the country, the foriegn countries (specially Japan) are really working hard in this field, that's for sure.

Well we do have something around 4-5 types of citrus around, but I bet you will never ever taste a better Apple all around the world than the Apples of Maidan Wardak province. They really taste amazing, along it the Pomegranate (Anaar) of Kandahar Province (one of my favorite) is also populer all over the place...

Any way back to the topic, if there is any other question still, you are most welcome to post it.

Thanx for the reply dear Gharanai.I was interested in progress made in the field of education because I think universal education is the first step in building a modern nation.It is good that Japanese are helping you in this field because Japan made a giant leap to modernity through universal education.All developing nations can learn a lot from the Japanese in this regard.

I would like to know about the developments made in the field of infrastructure for education all over Afghanistan.Like setting up buildings for schools,training new teachers,etc.Is this work being done all over Afghanistan or is it limited to Kabul and other major cities.I think if this work is done all over Afghanistan it would help different ethnicities better understand each other  and unite them in the long run.

It is nice to know that you are working as a volunteer in this field.I know this is a very crucial time for Afghanistan as a whole and you need help from everyone.I wish you success in your venture.In the long run I am very skeptical about the role of NGO's in helping develop a society.My part of world has thousands of NGO's.Those which are really committed don't have the funds and those which are able to attract funds start working like GO's [Government Organisations].I understand you are building from scratch right now so NGO's are welcome.

PS:Thanx for the information regarding Apples and Oranges of Afghanistan.I think Afghanistan is very famous for dry fruits too.Would you like to share some information on dry fruits of Afghanistan.I promise you fruits are very relevant to the development of Afghanistan so talking about fruits doesn't mean that we are deviating from the topic.

 

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  Quote Gharanai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Apr-2006 at 12:08

Originally posted by Apples n Oranges

I would like to know about the developments made in the field of infrastructure for education all over Afghanistan.Like setting up buildings for schools,training new teachers,etc.Is this work being done all over Afghanistan or is it limited to Kabul and other major cities.I think if this work is done all over Afghanistan it would help different ethnicities better understand each other  and unite them in the long run.

First of all thank for your reply and sorry for late replay, that's because I had exams. Afterwards, dear the development is going on on an average rate (taking the entire country), but still it's a very good idea to have it around no matter what is the rate but still the process is taking place. And you are right this process will help different ethnics and I tell you one thing, the different ethnic groups of Afghanistan is just like what Mongols used to be we only require a Gangis Khan to unite them all and then you know better what the Mongols achieved, that's why the western countries alway use the "Divide and Rule" formula on Afghans.

PS:Thanx for the information regarding Apples and Oranges of Afghanistan.I think Afghanistan is very famous for dry fruits too.Would you like to share some information on dry fruits of Afghanistan.I promise you fruits are very relevant to the development of Afghanistan so talking about fruits doesn't mean that we are deviating from the topic.

You got it very much right, Afghanistan is also famous for it's dry fruits, we have several types of dry fruits around us so do tell my what sort of information do you require regarding them...



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  Quote Apples n Oranges Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Apr-2006 at 12:35

Originally posted by Gharanai

First of all thank for your reply and sorry for late replay, that's because I had exams. Afterwards, dear the development is going on on an average rate (taking the entire country), but still it's a very good idea to have it around no matter what is the rate but still the process is taking place. And you are right this process will help different ethnics and I tell you one thing, the different ethnic groups of Afghanistan is just like what Mongols used to be we only require a Gangis Khan to unite them all and then you know better what the Mongols achieved, that's why the western countries alway use the "Divide and Rule" formula on Afghans.

Dear Gharanai Western countries always use the "Divide and Rule" formula.It has proved very successful for them over the past few centuries.They are using it in Afghanistan,Iraq,Ex-Yugoslavia,East/North-East Asia and a few other places right now.It won't be a bad idea to have a separate threas on "Divide and Rule" formula.

I know people of Afghanistan are very brave and honest.Strong central leadership is needed in order to unite the people of Afghanistan.How popular is President Karzai in Afghanistan.Is he seen as a true representative of the people or just as an American Puppet.

Apart from bravery and honesty you need education and economic development in order to become a successful Modern Nation.Mongols believe Chingis Khan would be born again.One Mongol member on this forum said Chingis Khan has been born again and he is 5 to 10 years old right now.I hope you get your Chingis Khan soon,who will unite and lead the Afghans in the direction of development and prosperity.

Originally posted by Gharanai

You got it very much right, Afghanistan is also famous for it's dry fruits, we have several types of dry fruits around us so do tell my what sort of information do you require regarding them...

Well it's not that I want any specific information.I know Afghanistan has many varieties of dry-fruits.I just wanted to give a suggestion,  the cultivation of fruits can be commercialised to help economic development of Afghanistan.

My area is very famous for Basmati Rice.It is said that Basmati Rice was introduced in my area by a exiled Afghan Prince/King about 150 years ago.I am sorry I've forgotten the name.Could you please search his name.

PS:I hope you did well in your exam.Information Technology is a very vital sector incase a nation wants to develop rapidly.I know your neighbours don't have much of an IT industry.Whats the view of the current Afghan Govt. regarding development in this field.

 

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  Quote Kalevipoeg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Apr-2006 at 13:18
I have always thought of Afghanistan as a country divided by clans. Even now, the US has nothing to do about the influence of different clans who dominate certain areas. Even if you have a central government in Afghanistan, different areas are uncontrollable as the land is too difficult to govern in my opinion. You may govern Kabul, but everything around it will be some sort of a "Afclanistan" and the government officials have little say.

Poppies still flourish, i don't know if the US doesn't care about wiping out most of the worlds heroine raw material production area, or are they afraid they'll lose their support of the land in that way. What a great democracy wave, allowing to bring heroine through Russia to my backyard, jolly o. Keep it up Uncle Sam. The US just wants control over the area to the extent it has right now which is sufficient in their terms, good ground for political influence over the area, nothing more.

As for Afghanistans history, it is much like Estonia, but totally different. A nation getting imperialist forces toying with it and using it as leverage and for other political means while the people themselves have to put up with it. Only that the Afghans are much fiercer in taking action, thats why gaining control there is times more difficult, or even impossible. You can hold the settlements under your fist, but not the mountains. At the same time, Estonians are maybe more united when it comes to knowing what they want governing them. The Afghan political model seems too complicated for my tasting. Whenever the imperialists leave Estonia, we'll put up a liberal democracy, but Afghanistan is much more uncertain in that aspect. Maybe it is the clan culture ruling the Afghan mind.
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  Quote Gharanai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Apr-2006 at 13:35
Originally posted by Apples n Oranges

How popular is President Karzai in Afghanistan.Is he seen as a true representative of the people or just as an American Puppet.

Well, he is on average, he is populer in North and Central country but he is know as a puppet by most in South and south-west.
I myself am in his favor taking in point that Afghanistan is developing, My idea is that "it's the modern age and you can't bring down a B-52 fighter with a throw of stone (as we used to do against the British), so in order to get the invaders out of your country first use the resources provided by them, develope yourself and then try to fight them."

That's what my point of view is, so I beleive that Mr. Karzai isn't doing bad as he is trying to stabilize the country and create a central control over the country rather than the control of factions. He is providing a fare balance to the ethnic groups as well which means people could not accuse him for being a Pashtun, so over all I would say he is the kind of guy Afghanistan requires at the moment.

Apart from bravery and honesty you need education and economic development in order to become a successful Modern Nation.

I would reply this line with only one phrase and that is "Very well said!"

Mongols believe Chingis Khan would be born again. One Mongol member on this forum said Chingis Khan has been born again and he is 5 to 10 years old right now.I hope you get your Chingis Khan soon,who will unite and lead the Afghans in the direction of development and prosperity.

 Well, that's interesting, The Reborn Gengis Khan! Interesting claim.
We have examples of our own country, a very good example is King Amanullah Khan Ghazi who got the independece, developed the country and made Afghanistan known by the world, but those westerners couldn't see Afghanistan develope so they ploted a propaganda against him.
I really wish to see a man of his caliber to rule the country, then we may wish for prosperity and real developement.

My area is very famous for Basmati Rice.It is said that Basmati Rice was introduced in my area by a exiled Afghan Prince/King about 150 years ago.I am sorry I've forgotten the name.Could you please search his name.

hmmmm I really don't know his name exactly at the moment but for sure I will try to find his name mean while would you mind telling my the area where you live, I know you live in India but which part.

PS:I hope you did well in your exam.Information Technology is a very vital sector incase a nation wants to develop rapidly.I know your neighbours don't have much of an IT industry.Whats the view of the current Afghan Govt. regarding development in this field.

Well thanks alot for your wishes and hopes. You are right Information Technology is very vital especially for countries trying to develope and Afghanistan too requires it so badly. I could had chosen Politics (my favorite), but then I thaught about what has our politisians done in last 3 decades for our country that I would do so I re-made my mind and choose IT as with it I could really do at least a single service to my Nation.

Well, the Government isn't so keen about this field yet as there are lots of other basic thing to be considered first. Maybe in future few years we get a boom in IT sector.



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  Quote Apples n Oranges Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Apr-2006 at 20:03

Originally posted by Gharanai

hmmmm I really don't know his name exactly at the moment but for sure I will try to find his name mean while would you mind telling my the area where you live, I know you live in India but which part.

Dehradun [Uttaranchal].

I'll also search his name.Maybe his name was Dost Khan.I'm not sure though.

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  Quote edgewaters Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Apr-2006 at 17:41
Originally posted by Gharanai

Well thanks alot for your wishes and hopes. You are right Information Technology is very vital especially for countries trying to develope and Afghanistan too requires it so badly.


I think Afghanistan has a future as a tourist destination. I know that seems sort of crazy to say right now, but, I really do think things are going to settle down at some point ... and it's the kind of country that people are really going to like to visit once it gets back on its feet. Alot of people will like to visit the culture for the very reason that it's not been as much affected by the modern world, mountainous areas are always popular tourist spots, and when the Chinese begin to develop a true middle class it will have the kind of history they're interested in. One of the biggest tragedies is all the destruction of the heritage in Afghanistan, but despite how bad it is, the good thing is that not alot of archaeological work ever got done there - meaning there is probably alot of stuff still buried and safe. Also in some ways, things like the destruction of the Bamiyan Buddhas is tragic but at the same time has helped put Afghan history on the map because of all the attention. There's alot of potential, I think, if peace can be restored.
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