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Would you "design" your baby? |
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Spartakus 
Tsar 
terörist Joined: 22-Nov-2004 Location: Greece/Hellas Online Status: Offline Posts: 4489 |
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 Topic: Would you "design" your baby?Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 05:53 |
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Eugenics,Nazism,Arian Superiority etc.Humans have already prooved their madness.How can we be sure that sth similar will not happen again?How can we be sure that the generation coming from " special designing" will not decide one day to exterminate all "inferior" humans?Simply,nobody can guarantee it. Also,what really is "perfection"?A flawless body and mind?It's very simplistic to think of that.In my opinion,only a human with flaws can become sth near to perfection.Because through our flaws and mistakes we can learn.If a man knows that his body,mind are "perfect",from where he will learn?He won't.
In the end,as carefull as we design our babies,they will never become perfect.Because they will be creations of humans,who are also imperfect. Edited by Spartakus - 16-Mar-2007 at 05:55 |
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"There are worse crimes than burning books. One of them is not reading them. "
--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996) |
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Genghis
Caliph 
Joined: 02-Aug-2004 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 2656 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 09:34 |
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Spartakus, this has nothing to do with nazism and to say that trying to improve the genetics of the next generation is evil because the Nazis did it makes as little sense as saying that speaking German is evil because it was the language of the Nazis. You must prove that trying to improve genetic fitness is evil in and of itself.
To think that the genetically augmented will one day wake up and decide to embark on a genocide of the unaugmented is ridiculous. Do we as a species decide to exterminate all subaverage people? With some exceptions, no, we don't why do you think genetically engineering somebody with an IQ of 150 and increased agility will make them genocidal? |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 09:54 |
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This time we are not talking about state eugenics, and robot like societies that prepare people in series. We are talking about a free-market economy of genes where the parents have the choice to avoid those genes that consider will harm theirs kids in life. Actually, this is not something about the future but about things that are happening right now. People with genetical disseases can be certain to reproduce healthy kid with genetical screening, today.Single women that want to have a smart or pretty can have it buying the "raw matterial" in the market. The price of the eggs of pretty and smart women are unbelievable expensive in the artificial reproduction market. Welcome to the future...
Pinguin
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Mortazaa
Janissary 
Joined: 15-Mar-2007 Location: Turkey Online Status: Offline Posts: 28 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 12:02 |
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Eugenics,Nazism,Arian Superiority etc.Humans have already prooved their madness.How can we be sure that sth similar will not happen again?How can we be sure that the generation coming from " special designing" will not decide one day to exterminate all "inferior" humans?Simply,nobody can guarantee it.
well, electricty or nuclear technology may be used against other people too. Even medicine is a dangerous science, you can create microps ext.. Should we stop our development because of our fears..
We should not stop our development. Cost maybe high but benefit will be higher.
Just think, If we enload mercy at every person.
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Spartakus
Tsar
terörist Joined: 22-Nov-2004 Location: Greece/Hellas Online Status: Offline Posts: 4489 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 16:54 |
I did not mention the "term" evil,did i?What i said is that we have a negative precedent,the Nazi precedent.What can assure me,that there are no "Nazis" today,who will want to exploit the situation so they can create a hyper race who will be against the "inferior" ones?
It is also ridiculous to think that the best war machine in the WWII created entire factories and an entire netwowrk of death ,when it lacked factories and work force for the production of weaponry,but it did happen.Nazis are gone,but not nessecarily their ideas. Edited by Spartakus - 16-Mar-2007 at 17:06 |
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"There are worse crimes than burning books. One of them is not reading them. "
--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996) |
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Spartakus
Tsar
terörist Joined: 22-Nov-2004 Location: Greece/Hellas Online Status: Offline Posts: 4489 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 17:00 |
We should be very causius when we use terms such as "benefit" and "development".China is developing,but look at it's pollution.It is also in our benefit to be friendly to the environment,yet we are not doing anything serious to protect it.Unstable terms for an unstable species,humans. Edited by Spartakus - 16-Mar-2007 at 17:01 |
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"There are worse crimes than burning books. One of them is not reading them. "
--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996) |
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Spartakus
Tsar
terörist Joined: 22-Nov-2004 Location: Greece/Hellas Online Status: Offline Posts: 4489 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 17:04 |
You said it yourself,free market economy of genes has to do with the present.But,who can assures me that this free economy will not become controlled in the future by some hardcore militans or crazy people who will direct it towards the "Aryan" idealism?
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"There are worse crimes than burning books. One of them is not reading them. "
--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996) |
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Mortazaa
Janissary
Joined: 15-Mar-2007 Location: Turkey Online Status: Offline Posts: 28 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 17:08 |
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We should be very causius when we use terms such as "benefit" and "development".China is developing,but look at it's pollution.
True, should she stop to develop?
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Spartakus
Tsar
terörist Joined: 22-Nov-2004 Location: Greece/Hellas Online Status: Offline Posts: 4489 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 17:11 |
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We should develop,yes,but with wisdom and caution.We have the power of knowledge,a knowledge unexistant in previous centuries.We should use it wisely.
Edited by Spartakus - 16-Mar-2007 at 17:12 |
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"There are worse crimes than burning books. One of them is not reading them. "
--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996) |
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Mortazaa
Janissary
Joined: 15-Mar-2007 Location: Turkey Online Status: Offline Posts: 28 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 17:17 |
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and we should use it widely.
I still insist we should benefit everything science offer. Even It is against to ethic. Ethic should order society, not stop it.
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 17:18 |
Do you have any idea of the suffering that stand hundred of millions of human beings born with genetical deseases? Do you believe that is right to accept the mistakes of Mother Nature?
For "Ayran" idealism, I don't know if the genetic market is "aryan" idealist. That's the choice of parents. They will decide.
Pinguin
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Spartakus
Tsar
terörist Joined: 22-Nov-2004 Location: Greece/Hellas Online Status: Offline Posts: 4489 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 17:32 |
Genetical diseases are a great issue,but genetical "design" is also a great issue.
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"There are worse crimes than burning books. One of them is not reading them. "
--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996) |
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Mortazaa
Janissary
Joined: 15-Mar-2007 Location: Turkey Online Status: Offline Posts: 28 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 17:54 |
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why? what is problem with it? We would have more developed people, we would have people who can resist disease more. More intelligent, more healty ext.
We cannot stop because poor cannot afford these. We did not stoped because poor cannot afford cars, holidays ext.
Also, If A science is not widely used, It will not be also enough cheap for poors.
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Spartakus
Tsar
terörist Joined: 22-Nov-2004 Location: Greece/Hellas Online Status: Offline Posts: 4489 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 18:02 |
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Well,poor people are an outcome of modern politics,not of human "imperfection".Most diseases are spread because of the lack of a proper health care system,not only because of human "imperfection".Illiterate people are an outcome of politics,not of human "imperfection".We can solve tons of problems without genetics.Let's do that first,and let genetics last. |
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"There are worse crimes than burning books. One of them is not reading them. "
--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996) |
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Mortazaa
Janissary
Joined: 15-Mar-2007 Location: Turkey Online Status: Offline Posts: 28 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 18:10 |
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We may solve a lot problem without cars, electricity too, but science is more efficent answer to problems. |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 18:10 |
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There are many problems that are not rooted in society but in failures in the DNA. Genetical diseasses are for real. And many people died or suffer cruel diseasses because of those. Several forms of mental problems (not all) are also rooted in genetics. So, assigning all the guilt to society just doesn't work. Some, yes, but not all. Mother Nature should also be ashame in many cases. Pinguin |
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Spartakus
Tsar
terörist Joined: 22-Nov-2004 Location: Greece/Hellas Online Status: Offline Posts: 4489 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 18:19 |
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There is no question that technology and science are usefull to man kind.The problem here is how science and technology will be used .Nuclear technology is really good,but smart humans made it the most terrible weapon on earth.........
Edited by Spartakus - 16-Mar-2007 at 18:20 |
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"There are worse crimes than burning books. One of them is not reading them. "
--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996) |
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malizai_
Sultan 
Alcinous Joined: 05-Feb-2006 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2252 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 20:56 |
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Survival of the fittest, No!, design of the fittest. Let the best design win. |
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Genghis
Caliph
Joined: 02-Aug-2004 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 2656 |
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 20:59 |
Haha.
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 22:16 |
You bet
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