The Slavic element in Homer's epics

Originally posted by Petro Invictus WOW! How excellent! Οδεύω indeed meant to march! Οδός indeed meant a road! Odyssey then means a JOURNEY! What was that French explanation, by the way! However in modern Greek the word for road is:δρόμος (dromos), and the word for marching is: περπατώ (perpato), πορεία (poreia), εμβατήριο (embatirio)... In modern day Macedonian it is ODI SI, to GO AWAY (on a journey), in Russian it is: идти, in Serbian it is HODITI! While in modern Greek it is πηγαίνω (pigaino)... Can you explain this to me!

Bre Petro, bre Petro...I give you words in Greek not latinized so that you can check out things...This is a waste of time otherwise.

This tool will help you out in 95% of the cases...

http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_txt

Dromos and Odos are synonyms...

Περπατώ means "I walk".

Πορεία is course.

Οδεύω is exactly what I said...Again, Odyssey derives from Odysseus and his story but the name Odysseus is from Odyssomai which means "to be annoyed, to be irritated against, to hate (directional hate)".

As for the rest Petro, we'll take it tomorow. I have to go now. But remember... Check out what you write before, especially when you deal with matters you're getting a third person view. You don't know Greek and you know i'm a native speaker.

I can't hurt my feelings - firstly, I don't feel any nationalist pride, secondly I'm SLOVAK - I don't care.

What about the syntax, phonology, grammar and morphology??? Is it Slavic too??

Originally posted by Slayertplsko I can't hurt my feelings - firstly, I don't feel any nationalist pride, secondly I'm SLOVAK - I don't care. What about the syntax, phonology, grammar and morphology??? Is it Slavic too??

It could be if we analyze it together! Aren't you excited as a Slovak to check it out!

By the way this is what a compatriot of yours would say on the issue:

http://www.maknews.com/html/articles/spevak/trojan_era.htm

"It is my belief that the Achaeans did not speak a proto-Slavic language. If their vocabulary contained proto-Slavic words it is most likely they were borrowed from the Pelasgi or other Slavic-speaking tribes. I believe the Achaeans spoke a language that was more closely related to the language family of the later City States, but surely it wasn’t the same as that which was brought from Thessaly by the Dorians."

This being his personal opinion of course! I disagree with some of it, however, it is an alternative point of view!

I agree that the Pelasgi were Slav speaking tribe, and there we go the Macedonians are not that far, are they?

How about these:

Homer: prosphêmi,prosephê; English: to speak to, address; Macedonian: PROZVE, PROZIVA; Greek: μιλώ (milo), μιλήστε

Homer: eimi,eseai, estai; English: to be, to exist; Macedonian: (JE)SUM, (JE)SI, (JE)STE ; Greek: be=είμαι, βρίσκομαι (eimai, briskomai),exist=υπάρχω, υφίσταμαι (yparcho, yfistamai)

Homer: emos,emôi; English: mine; Macedonian: MOJ, MOJA, MOI, MOE; Greek: δικός μου (dikos mou)

Homer: houtos, touto; English: that; Macedonian: TOA(TE); Greek:εκείνος, ότι, ώστε (ekeinos, oti, oste)

I particularly like the first entry:prosephê! In modern day Macedonian it is PROZVE! What is it in Slovakian?

Originally posted by Petro Invictus The syntax, morphology, grammar and even phonetics has changed a lot since Homer's time!

Sure, the same can be said of English, Norwegian or Swedish - however, those three are still clearly Germanic, as the 'basis' of language usually doesn't change much.

Originally posted by Slayertplsko The fact you found a few words that are (maybe) used in Macedonian Slavic can mean that you have got it from Hellenic languages.

That is not an exception! However, how do you suggest we should explain the use of those FEW WORDS in other Slavic languages. Compare:

TO SEE:

Russian - видеть (VIDET)

Polish - WIDZIEĆ (VIDIETS)

Ukrainian - vyhliadaty (VIHLIADATI)

Croatian - VIDI

Macedonian - VIDE, VIDEN

Homeric - IDEON

Greek - VLEPO ?!?!

Sure you do not imply that Homer was traveling across Russia, selling wine to the Polish and singing his epics to the Ukrainian?

'nazvať' means 'to give a name to'/'to call' (perfective) only, nothing more. 'prezvať' (which would be an equivalent to prozvati) doesn't exist.

to name - menovať, vymenovať....
to adress to - osloviť, oslovovať....
to speak to - hovoriť (s)...



Edited by Slayertplsko - 14-Jun-2008 at 19:07

Originally posted by Slayertplsko Is prosephe also composed of a verb sephe with a preffix pro??

INDEED: PROSEPHE (προσέφη) προς(=to, towards)+έφη(=he said), from verb φημί(phimi=Ι say), past: έφην.

HOWEVER:

PRO is a suffix in Macedonian used to create phrasal verb patterns!

ZOVE, ZVE means TO CALL, TO NAME, TO ADDRESS!!! Similar to the root of the Slovak NA-ZVE!!! NA being a suffix, mind you, suffixes have different application in different languages even of similar origin!

PROZOVE means to ADDRESS someone! TO CALL UPON!!! We use this for example in school when the teacher calls the students by name.

Exactly the same as in Homer's text! Zeus was calling "her" (Just like an authority would do): "Strange one,1 you are always suspecting, and I do not escape you; yet you shall be able to accomplish nothing, but shall be even further from my heart."

In modern Greek the term has lost its root form in its modern use! "λέγω", "γνώμη" has a different root form than what was used in Homer's epics!

While: "φημί" (fimi) means to say YES! To confirm!

So if we analyze your etymology of the ancient Greek, which mind you has been irreversibly imposed into modern Greek via the Katharevousa, it turns out that Homer said something like:

INSTEAD: "Then in answer to her spoke Zeus" it would be: "Then towards her he said YES!" Or what do you suggest?

Again I am not suggesting that the modern Greek is deprived of Homer's words! However, it might be the legacy of the political intrusion of another artificial language such as the Katharevousa that at the time has created such a diglossic confusion in Greece, that still has consequences even on you!!!

Otherwise, as I said, I'm Slovak and I don't really care, so the discussion is up to you and Flipper. But really, a full stop looks better than an exclamation point

Originally posted by Slayertplsko I just want to say to you: you needn't do this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!....this is enough: .

I like it! It is scientifically challenging to me!