Serb Church outlawed in Macedonia; priest fights back

The Serbian Orthodox Church is illegal in Macedonia. It is a
crime in the republic to be a Serbian Orthodox Priest or to
attend Serbian Orthodox religious gatherings.

This was an attempt (in my opinion misguided) to combat what
Macedonians have for decades viewed as Serbian influence in
their religious affairs. When it had control over the Macedonian
churches, the Serbian Orthodox Church censored Macedonian
priests and shifted priests around in a deliberate attempt to
enflame tensions against Macedonia's Albanian minority in
border towns. Politics were introduced into church sermons in a
level never before experienced in Macedonia and the public
backlash was swift and, obviously severe.

Personally, I'm on side with the Macedonians in that regard -
but making any mainstream church illegal is a little bit harsh.
Please don't make this thread about Macedonia's name, a
blacklisted topic. You can call it Macedonia, FYROMacedonia,
Vadarska, the cucumber, whatever you like. This is about the
church and keep it that way.

Anyhow, here's an article from the Christian Science Monitor
with the latest developments:

Jailed priest pushes for religious freedom
Jovan Vraniskovski has been in and out of prison since he
broke with Macedonia's dominant church.
By Beth Kampschror

SKOPJE, MACEDONIA � With shades drawn and candles
burning, a small band of Serbian Orthodox followers meets
here every Sunday morning in a little fourth-floor apartment for
a semisecret liturgy.

The secrecy, say the followers of controversial archbishop
Jovan Vraniskovski, stems from a lack of religious freedom in
Macedonia - even as the former Yugoslav republic tries to
shake off its past and join the European Union (EU).

The priest has been mired in allegations - and was even
thrown in prison - since he broke with the dominant
Macedonian Orthodox Church (MOC) in July 2002. His recent
release, says a human rights organization working on his
behalf, means little since Macedonian law forbids the
archbishop from registering his church.

"It's absolute nonsense in the framework of international
articles and European conventions," says Mirjana Najcevska,
president of the Macedonian chapter of the Helsinki Committee
for Human Rights.

The committee filed their case with the European Court of
Human Rights last month after Macedonia's highest court
upheld a law forbidding the establishment of the Serbian
Orthodox Church in the country. The committee's action was
also prompted by ongoing police and mob harassment of
Vraniskovski's followers.

Relations between the Macedonian and Serbian Orthodox
churches have been sour since the Macedonians declared
independence from the Serbian church in 1967.

Four years ago, the Serbian church invited the Macedonian
spinoff to rejoin the fold. Vraniskovski accepted the offer. The
MOC promptly banished him, while the Serbs appointed him
head of the Serbian church within Macedonia in May 2003.

That's when his rap sheet began to grow. In July 2003, he was
arrested for trying to baptize a child. In 2004, he was arrested,
along with several monks, for holding a liturgy in his
Bitolaapartment in southern Macedonia.

In 2005, he was sentenced to two and a half years - including a
one-year suspended sentence for the apartment liturgy - for
handing out church calendars and thus inciting religious
hatred. He began serving that sentence in July, and was
released last month after it was shortened to eight months. Ms.
Najcevska says pressure from Western embassies and
European organizations helped to secure his release.

But Vraniskovski faces more prison time on allegations of
financial misconduct, including one to two years for stealing
57,000 euros ($69,000) in 2001 and 2002 when he was still
with the MOC.

Other charges that Vraniskovski embezzled hundreds of
thousands of euros while he'd been a high-ranking bishop in
the MOC were thrown out earlier this month by a court in Veles,
just south of the Macedonian capital.

But MOC officials have not let up their case against
Vraniskovski. MOC Synod chair Professor Ratomir Grozdanski
says Vraniskovski is helping the Serbian church undermine the
religion, identity, and nationhood of Macedonians. MOC faithful
point out that their church has its roots in the 9th century, and
religion has provided the backbone of Macedonian identity
throughout centuries of bloody attacks by neighboring
Orthodox countries.

Even today, Macedonia struggles to stake out its national
identity. Bulgarians often don't recognize the Macedonian
language, Greeks don't recognize the country's name, and Prof.
Grozdanski says the Serbs don't recognize Macedonian
nationality.

"One Serbian Orthodox churchman told me, 'If I can find one
Macedonian here, I'd recognize the Macedonian church,' "
Grozdanski says. "The Serbian church hasn't got over its
imperial wishes for power over this place."

But Vraniskovski dismisses this. "I think that their struggle is a
struggle against competition," he says, adding that he was
convicted for his beliefs and not for anything else. "[Officials]
would be happy if the problem about my imprisonment had
remained only an internal problem of the Republic of
Macedonia. Perhaps it would have been the case if I was
convicted for some other criminal offense, and not for what I
believe in and why."

Other Serb Orthodox believers in Macedonia have had
numerous difficulties as well. Teacher Monika Dodova says
police questioned her teenage students about whether she
was spreading church propaganda. Kiril Mirakovski says he
was fired by the weekly Makedonija Denes for writing about the
trampling of religious freedom in the country. And Zoran
Georgiev says he was thrown out of a theological faculty for
going to a Serbian Orthodox liturgy.

Father Borjan Vitanov, a former MOC priest who embraced
Serbian Orthodoxy to be part of a larger world church, was
beaten last July by a mob. Just two days later, a second mob
looted the private house he'd been using for liturgies.

Two short videos on Mr. Vitanov's cellphone show the houses
destroyed, overturned furniture, and "MOC" spray-painted on
an outside wall. This and other incidents - including police
harassment of followers, and mobs physically attacking
buildings and leaders of Macedonian Catholics and Jehovah's
Witnesses - were confirmed by the Helsinki Committee here.

I think - at least I hope - we're past a point in the Balkans where countries can cease to exist. I imagine more will break apart into smaller units, especially in the former Yugoslavia (Bihac and northwest Bosnia is not going to remain in Bosnia much longer if Croatia continues to surge so far ahead of us - they already have two "Western Bosnia" (ie: Croatian Muslim) parties working towards independence; and that's just the little-known ones, there's bigger ones like Kosovo and Montenegro).

So I think Macedonia will be around for a while though I don't know what sort of country it's going to be if things like this continue. I mean, banning a religion is a very big deal - that's not even been done in Croatia, Bosnia, or Serbia.

Ovo je sranje.

Bah, I doubt it reflects a majority of Macedonians - just the right-wingers in power as usual.

EDIT: And yeah, the social conflicts between Slav and Albanian Macedonians are strong than between members of the Macedonian and Serbian churches; but Slav Macedonians seem more concerned with that conflict, because of it's nature - it has an internal quality the Slav/Albanian conflict doesn't really have.


Edited by Mila

Originally posted by Mila Slav Macedonians seem more concerned with that conflict, because of it's nature - it has an internal quality the Slav/Albanian conflict doesn't really have.

I'd say it's exactly the opposite: the relgious conflict has an external nature (conflict with Serbia possibly) and the ethnic conflict has an internal nature (conflict inside Macedonia). You, Balcanics, are so communitarianist that see things with inverted persepctive or what?

Not being any significative number of Serbs in Macedonia, any conflict with Serbia is always an EXTERNAL conflict, the best to unite the INTERNAL factions such as Slav-Macedonians and Albano-Macedonians against a common foe (even if it is a ghostly one).

Originally posted by Spartakus No offennse, but the Greeks really need to get over Macedonia... No offense,but we will not stop fighting for our history.

No offense, but it is not history that you are fighting for, you are fighting for a version of history that was used to justify the ethnic cleansing of slavic macedonians from their homes. You are manipulating history to serve the present purpose of your state which has always been to undermine slavic statehood in Macedonia.

Concerning the Serbians ...

If Serbia was interfering with internal matters of the Republic of Macedonia, in which they have a long history, I see this ban as a justified response on part of the Republic of Macedonia to safeguard its soveregnity.

Similar restrictions exist in other countrie too. For instance the Macedonian church would not be allowed to operate in Greece.

I believe it is wrong  to view this ban as a ban on the entire religion (as Mila seems to have suggested). We are not talking about a ban on the entire orthodox religion, we are simply talking about a restriction on an organization, namely the Serbian Orthodox Church, which has a history of interference into matters internal for the Macedonian states and which has always been used as a conductor of Serbian influence over Macedonia.

Edited by bg_turk

Originally posted by Maju Originally posted by Mila Slav Macedonians seem more concerned with that conflict, because of it's nature - it has an internal quality the Slav/Albanian conflict doesn't really have. I'd say it's exactly the opposite: the relgious conflict has an external nature (conflict with Serbia possibly) and the ethnic conflict has an internal nature (conflict inside Macedonia). You, Balcanics, are so communitarianist that see things with inverted persepctive or what? Not being any significative number of Serbs in Macedonia, any conflict with Serbia is always an EXTERNAL conflict, the best to unite the INTERNAL factions such as Slav-Macedonians and Albano-Macedonians against a common foe (even if it is a ghostly one).

Thanks for trying to bring the topic back.

I agree with your definitions, I'm just using the wrong words... so how do I explain it.

Macedonian's don't consider their Albanian people to be "Macedonian". You'll never hear the term "Macedonian Albanians" or anything like that - they're just Albanians. There's no kinship, no sense of historical connection (though obviously there is), etc, etc, etc. Albanians, in Macedonia or not, are outsiders.

Serbs are also Slavs and I think that makes the fight more internal and personal to Slav Macedonians. You'll always see more anti-Serb grafitti anywhere in Macedonia than either anti-Albanian or anti-SlavMacedonian.

Has to do with other things as well. Macedonia was the only republic that left Yugoslavia without being attacked. They know damn well the only reason for that is because of their huge Albanian population and Serbian concerns over Kosovo. So they're always on the defensive when it comes to Serbia - same as Slovenia, which always considered itself above the rest of us, and here's peasant Serb soldiers marching on Ljubljana - oh no, f--k that sh*t. Those two countries really have it...deep mistrust, etc.

I think you're right, Akolouthos. I tend to have more respect for the Macedonian Orthodox Church, though, simply it remains more devoted to faith than politics. I don't think people realize the extent to which Serbian churches in Bosnia, Serbia, and Kosovo deliver political sermons as opposed to religious ones. The New Orthodox Church in Sarajevo even advertised in the papers when it stopped doing so, to attract more worshippers.

But technically speaking, I guess they are schismatics then? As for banning a religion, completely... just a hideous thing to do. It will only serve to radicalize those Macedonians loyal to the Serb Church, just as the same situation would have the same circumstances regarding Islam in a Western European country.

There are countless ways to ensure the Serb Church in Macedonia does not promote intolerance or all of these things the Macedonians fear. The backlash against such things is actually radicalizing the Macedonians as well. They came out by the hundreds of thousands to vote down a proposal - backed by the Serb church - to revoke many of the special civil liberties afforded to the Albanians in the country. But at these protests that were based in defending tolerance and defeating xenophobia, everything was anti-Serb... so it's having undesired consequences as well.

Who knows how it will all turn out. But I think it's definitely wrong to ban any faith.

Hehehe. Well, of course it is not just a problem with Christianity. If we don't steer this discussion somewhere it will just go back to the name issue... so I don't mind elaborating.

In Bosnia, we actually have a structure governing Islam. We have a Chief Mullah, Mustafa ef. Ceric, who is at least in theory in control of all of the country's Imams. Now he's very reluctant to remove any Imams, generally for fear of making the situation in their fundamentalist areas even worse and also because - I believe, from his actions and his words - that he has compassion to want to rehabilitate these Imams rather than remove them.

There's a few examples of this, on and on. Generally nationalism among Muslims in the Balkans is based in community organizations. If Muslims want to get together and slander Serbs, they go to the Bosniak Folk Festival or the Young Muslims Community Center. Mosques are more... suited to a certain level of observance and fundamentalism, without specifics. You'll never hear "kill the Serbs" at a Bosnian mosque, but you will hear "Islam is the only way" at some, where such people go. You'll hear good things about Christianity and bad things about Serbian nationalism in most, etc. If Serbs want to do it to Muslims, they go to Church. Roman Catholics are a bit unique, on the surface it would appear there is no politics in their practice of their faith but it's just a matter of believed superiority. For them, drinking the wine in a Roman Catholic church in Jesus name is better insult and proof of themselves than anything a priest could say.

So I mean... what can you realistically do with all three?

EDIT: And don't dare suggest socialism. We tried, didn't really work out that well - especially for my end of the bargain.


Edited by Mila

They're also organized into smaller organizations called Medzlis. Typically a Medzlis will represent all of the Imams in a geographic area, for example, Sarajevo.

All of the mosques and all of the Imams will generally share topics. Sermons at King Fahd Mosque will be about... Adam and Eve... on the same day that is the topic at Gazi Husref-Bey's Mosque, and Ali Pasha Mosque, and White Mosque, and Csar's Mosque, etc. Now each sermon will be very different. At Gazi Husref-Bey's Mosque it's more spiritual, abstract, Sufi mysticism in style. At King Fahd it's more literal.

They'll also provide basic information, descriptions of each mosque at the Imam. For example, the Sarajevo Medzlis lists the Ali Pasha Mosque, describes its history, and says the Imam is a Sljivo Meho, who was born in 1973 in Jajce (Bosnia). He got his education at the Gazi Husref-bey Medresa and Faculty of Islamic Studies in Sarajevo.

For the Bascarsija Mosque, it says the Imam is Muhamed Cajlakovic. He's from the village of Serici in the municipality of Zenica and was born in 1964. He was also educated at the Gazi Husref-bey Medresa.

But look at the Ilidza Mosque, one of the problem mosques, and you'll see the Imam is Enver Prolaz. He was born in 1951 is Ostrakovic, in the municipality of Visoko. He was educated at the Islamic Faculty in Lybia. If you look at his previous experience, it is all in fairly fundamentalist areas of Bosnia: Visegrad, Kiseljak, Busovaca, Janja, Zenica, Gornji Vakuf; all cities where Bosniaks were devastated during the war and consequently more inclined to fundamentalist interpretations of Islam today.

For example, the Visegrad mosque was only rebuilt last year - in a city where hundreds of Muslim - men and women - had their throats slit on the bridge and dumped into the Drina river. So of course, the style of Islam there is tainted with pain and desire for revenge.

A couple of photos from the re-opening last year:






Edited by Mila