Learning one of the Scandinavian Languages

Originally posted by Northman About the going to town expression, in Danish we commonly use to state it like:   "Jeg/han/hun tager til byen i morgen" ="I/he/she/ am/is/is going to town tomorrow" - where we use "tager til"(taking to) instead of "going to." The means of transportation doesn't matter. I think this is also used in Norwegian and Swedish.

Originally posted by gcle2003 Originally posted by Northman About the going to town expression, in Danish we commonly use to state it like:   "Jeg/han/hun tager til byen i morgen" ="I/he/she/ am/is/is going to town tomorrow" - where we use "tager til"(taking to) instead of "going to." The means of transportation doesn't matter. I think this is also used in Norwegian and Swedish.  In that tradition, English has "I'm off to town/Paris/a funeral/whatever tomorrow". But I was mostly interested here in the distinct verbs for 'go' (by vehicle or otherwise), rather than the permutations specifying exactly the manner of going ('I rode/ swam/ ran/ drove/ hopped" and so on, which I guess all languages have).    If I can go again, a standard way of asking a question in English and Irish is "He did it, didn't he?", "we were going to the cinema tonight, weren't we?", "You have been there, haven't you?"   Does that reversed verb tag construction exist in any Scandinavian languages?

Here is a summary of the grammar points found in Danbolt Chapter 7

Chapter 7
Grammar Point 1
Personal Pronouns (Subject form)
-These personal pronouns are used to represent the subject of a sentence.
     EG
     1st sg.   Jeg - I
     2nd sg. Du - You
     3rd sg. Han/hun/den/det - he/she/it

     1st pl. Vi - we
     2nd pl. dere - you
     3rd pl. de - they

Grammar Point 2
Possessives
-Possessives give information about who owns something
-These pronouns are represented in the following form
     Eg
     min/mitt/mine        my/mine
     din/ditt/dine           your/yours
     hans           \                             his
     hennes          sin/sitt/sine      her/hers
     dens           /                            its
     dets          /                               its

     vår/vårt/våre             our/ours
     deres                           your/yours (pl)
     deres            sin/sitt/sine       their/theirs
-There are two things to remember about possessives
     -If you put a possessive before a noun the noun is in the indefinite, whereas if the possessive follows the noun, the noun is in the definite
           EG
           -Min tante er tykk. (My aunt is fat)
           -Tanten min er tykk (My aunt is fat)
           -Hennes bror er i fengsel (Her brother is in prison)
           -Broren hennes er i fengsel (Her brother is in prison)
     -If the possessive refers back to the subject of the sentence but is not the subject itself you use the reflexive sin in the 3rd sg and pl.

(I don't understand why there are three forms for the 1st and 2nd persons sg. and 1st pl in the possessive. Is this because min is used for the en words mitt for the et words and mine for the plurals of these words

Grammar Point 3
Verbs: Weak Groups 1 and 2
Group 1
å vente          venter            ventet   (to wait)
å rydde        rydder            ryddet   (to tidy)
å arbeide      arbeider        arbeidet (to work)
Group 2
å spise          spiser              spiste (to eat)
å drepe        dreper             drepte (to kill)
å reise          reiser               reiste (to travel)

Grammar Point 4
leke/spille to play
-Leke is used for playing with toys, whereas spille is used for any other kind of playing (sports, games, gambling, musical instruments, theater, etc.)
-Both of these verbs are weak and belong to group 2
     -spille loses an "l" when forming the past tense.

Edited by King John - 06-Jun-2008 at 20:47

Here is a summary of what is going on in Danbolt Chapter 8. Thank you EbbeLockert for the clarification.

Chapter 8
Grammar Point 1
VERBS
-So far we have seen two forms of conjugating verbs (the Present and the Past). There is another for of the past called the Perfect. The difference between the Past and the Perfect forms is as follows:
     -Past: describes something which has already happened
     IE: Jeg hadde vondt i hodet i går. (I had a headache yesterday)
     -Perfect: This tense is also about the past, however, it could still be going on
     IE: Jeg har hatt vondt i hodet hele dagen. (I have had a headache all day)
-The Perfect tense is formed with the verb å ha (to have) and the past participle (ppp), as in English.
     -Sometimes the past participle (ppp) is the same as the past tense form (this is true for group 1 weak verbs). Often the ppp is an entirely different form of the verb.

Grammar Point 2
Groups of Weak Verbs
-There are four groups of weak verbs. Most weak verbs belong to groups 1 and 2 but some fall into groups 3 and 4.
     
     -Group 1 (all are listed infinitive, pres, past. perfect
     å klippe     klipper     klippet     har klippet (to cut)
     å kaste     kaster     kastet     har kastet (to throw)
     å stoppe     stopper     stoppet     har stoppet (to stop)

     -Group 2
     å smile     smiler     smilte     har smilt (to smile)
     å røre     rører     rørte     har rørt (to move)
     å tenke     tenker     tenkte     har tenkt (to think)

     -Group 3
     å leve     lever     levde     har levd (to live/be alive)
     å prøve     prøver     prøvde     har prøvd (to try)

     -Group 4
     å bo     bor     bodde     har bodd (to live/reside)
     å nå     når     nådde     har nådd (to reach)
     å tro     tror     trodde    har trodd (to believe)

Grammar Point 3
Some Strong Verbs
-listed in the same form as the weak verbs listed above

     å drikke     drikker      drakk     har drukket (to drink)
     å brekke     brekker     brakk     har brukket (to break)
     å hjelpe     hjelper     hjalp     har hjulpet (to help)
     å ligge     ligger      lå     har ligget (to lie)
     å set     ser     så     har sett (to set)
     å si     sier     sa      har sagt (to say)

Grammar Point 4
Personal Pronouns
-We have already seen these pronouns in the subject form, now we will look at them in their object form.

1st sg     Jeg (I)       meg (me)
2nd sg   du (you)    deg (you)
3rd sg    han           ham (him)    \
               hun           henne (her)   \
               den           den (it)           /    seg (reflexive pronoun)
               det            det (it)          /
1st pl      vi               oss (us)
2nd pl     dere        dere (you)
3rd pl      de            dem (them)        seg (reflexive pronoun)

-these pronouns are used in the same way as in English

Grammar Point 5
Reflexive Pronouns
-The reflexive forms for the 1st and 2nd sg are the same as the object form.
     Jeg setter meg    (I sit (myself) down).
     du setter deg
     han/hun setter seg

     Vi setter oss
     Dere setter dere
     De setter seg

Grammar Point 6
Reflexive Verbs
-There are many verbs in Norwegian that are reflexive

     Jeg føler meg dårlig (I feel ill)
     Jeg skal gifte meg (I shall marry)
     Hun skal gifte seg (he'll marry)
     Vi skal gifte oss (We'll marry)
     De skal gifte seg (They'll marry)
     Hun liker seg i Oslo (He likes to be in Oslo)

That's pretty much all there is for chapter 8. I hope all who are using this find it useful.

Originally posted by Slayertplsko Hi there. I just took up learning Norwegian....and got a question: could someone give me a full list of Norwegian strong verbs please??

The book that I am summarizing here has a list of strong verbs at the back that spans 2 pages or so. If I am feeling very industrious I will try to copy it out for you. (The book that I am using is Teach Yourself: Norwegian it is authored by Margaretha Danbolt Simons. It is part of the Teach Yourself series of language courses.)

Sorry, I have another silly question.

I found out today, that my favourite Old Norse word 'bjórr' is missing in Norwegian. Only øl.
Is it really so, that øl is the only word for beer??? It is my favourite word, together with mjóðr.

Originally posted by Slayertplsko Sorry, I have another silly question. I found out today, that my favourite Old Norse word 'bjórr' is missing in Norwegian. Only øl. Is it really so, that øl is the only word for beer??? It is my favourite word, together with mjóðr.

It still exists dialectally in Swedish, so there's a big chance the same goes for Norwegian.

It seems to be completely sufficient to indicate connection between two languages if you can just find two words that have a couple of letters in common, and aren't entirely different in meaning.

Edited by gcle2003 - 10-Jun-2008 at 17:18

Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri Ale, form Old English Alo, Old Saxon/Scythian Alu (Beer):   http://starling.rinet.ru/cgi-bin/response.cgi?single=1&basename=/data/cauc/caucet&text_number=1450&root=config   It is certainly an old Iranian (Scythian) loanword, ultimately going back to a Germanic source (Proto-Germanic *aluđ 'beer' < PIE *alut-). The root is still present in Osset. älūton, and was also borrowed (probably from an early Ossetian source) into Georg. ludi (dial. aludi) 'beer' - ...

One minor problem. The word for ale/beer in Anglo-Saxon/Old English is not alo, as you claim. It is ealu: "ealu [] n (ealoð/ealoð) ale, beer; an intoxicating drink [gen ealoð; dat ealoð; nom/acc pl."1 Other than that problem your source does not talk about Old English and Old Saxon. It does however talk about Old Iranic (Scythian). As you can see from your source the etymology of ale is based in Proto-Germanic from there it goes into Old Iranian then Osset and so on.

Let's try and keep this thread on topic. We are discussing the Scandinavian languages and learning one, specifically Norwegian.