Notice: This is the official website of the All Empires History Community (Reg. 10 Feb 2002)

  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Unit 731
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
Author
  Share Topic Share Topic  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
Husaria View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian
Avatar

Joined: 28-Jul-2008
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 150 		  Quote Husaria Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Unit 731
    Posted: 06-Sep-2008 at 19:52
I have done a little research on them and all i can say is i am realy sickened by what lengths people can go when it comes to brutality. But they do give off a kind of interest its like somthing out of a horror movie that i just can't bring myself to thinking happended. Not realy a question or anything but what do you guys think?
Back to Top
Cryptic View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke

Retired AE Moderator

Joined: 05-Jul-2006
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1962 		  Quote Cryptic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Sep-2008 at 22:36
Horrible acts of medical experiments on human beings have occurred under the authority of Nazi Germany (largest scale offender), Imperial Japan (unit 731) and to a lesser extent, Jim Crow USA (Tuskegee experiment).
 
One interesting fact is that all three governments were right wing. Though left wing governments have also committed atrocities, human experimentation does not seem to be one of them. Perhaps it is because the medical experiments had a strong rascist background and left wing extremists reject rascism. Even still, it is interesting to note that left wing extremists have not committed medical atrocities on "class enemies".


Edited by Cryptic - 06-Sep-2008 at 22:38
Back to Top
Husaria View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian
Avatar

Joined: 28-Jul-2008
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 150 		  Quote Husaria Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Sep-2008 at 02:21
Germany Did more medical experiments? i read somewere that unit 731 unleased plague on the chinese and killed like 20 000 people if you consider that a experiment in biological warfare.
Back to Top
Cryptic View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke

Retired AE Moderator

Joined: 05-Jul-2006
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1962 		  Quote Cryptic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Sep-2008 at 13:38
^
German medial experiments were more varied and included using humans for high altitude, cold weather tests. Other human subjects were used in steilization, genetics. In addition, the German killing of the mentally retarded or severely disabled had medical over tones.
 
As far as numbers of fatalities go, thaty canbe difficult to determine. Counting the Pre War Nazi  killing of the disabled as medical raises their numbers. At the same time, some of Unit 731's activities were exaggerated by the post war Chinese Communist government for various reasons.  Manchuria, though a puppet state, was a nominal Japanese ally. 
 
Deliberalty releasing plague amongst the general civlian population seems very unlikely to me. It is  possible, however, that the plague releases did occur. In either case, what is known is that a large amount of deliberate human suffering occurred at the site.


Edited by Cryptic - 08-Sep-2008 at 15:53
Back to Top
Temujin View Drop Down
King
King
Avatar
Sirdar Bahadur

Joined: 02-Aug-2004
Location: Eurasia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Sep-2008 at 15:50
Originally posted by Cryptic

left wing extremists reject rascism.


that's a fantasy.
Back to Top
Cryptic View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke

Retired AE Moderator

Joined: 05-Jul-2006
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1962 		  Quote Cryptic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 15:53
Originally posted by Temujin

Originally posted by Cryptic

left wing extremists reject rascism.

that's a fantasy.
Do you have any examples?
Back to Top
Temujin View Drop Down
King
King
Avatar
Sirdar Bahadur

Joined: 02-Aug-2004
Location: Eurasia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 19:41
Soviet Union? China?
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 20:41
Originally posted by Cryptic

Even still, it is interesting to note that left wing extremists have not committed medical atrocities on "class enemies".

North Korea does
Back to Top
Sarmat View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 31-May-2007
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3113 		  Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 20:50
Originally posted by Temujin

Soviet Union? China?
 
There was no "racism" in the Soviet Union.


Edited by Sarmat12 - 08-Sep-2008 at 21:31
Σαυρομάτης
Back to Top
Temujin View Drop Down
King
King
Avatar
Sirdar Bahadur

Joined: 02-Aug-2004
Location: Eurasia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 20:57
well i have living people to proove the contrary...
Back to Top
Sarmat View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 31-May-2007
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3113 		  Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 21:14
You can't prove the thing which didn't exist.
Σαυρομάτης
Back to Top
Sarmat View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 31-May-2007
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3113 		  Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 21:20
Originally posted by Cryptic

^
German medial experiments were more varied and included using humans for high altitude, cold weather tests. Other human subjects were used in steilization, genetics. In addition, the German killing of the mentally retarded or severely disabled had medical over tones.
 
 
I'm really not sure about this. Unit 731 performed all these experiment as well. Besides, the did some really terrible stuff like testing flame flowers and microwave impact on living people.
 
I actually have the feeling that unit 731 crimes was even more inhuman and terrible than those of Nazists.
 
The worst thing is however that unlike Nazist scientists a lot of which were prosecuted, Japanese maniacs succesfully avoided any trials and few people in modern Japan actually know anything about unit 731.
Σαυρομάτης
Back to Top
Roberts View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain

aka axeman

Joined: 22-Aug-2005
Location: Riga
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1138 		  Quote Roberts Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 21:20
Originally posted by Sarmat12

You can't prove the thing which didn't exist.

Do you mean racism against people of different skin colour or different ethnicities?
Back to Top
Sarmat View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 31-May-2007
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3113 		  Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 21:24

I mean primary skin colour i.e. descrimination against people of ther races. Like Mongoloid for example in the USSR.
Σαυρομάτης
Back to Top
Husaria View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian
Avatar

Joined: 28-Jul-2008
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 150 		  Quote Husaria Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 21:27
Sarmat12 I have to agree with you to me it seems Unit 731 was worse than the Nazi doctors.
Back to Top
Cryptic View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke

Retired AE Moderator

Joined: 05-Jul-2006
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1962 		  Quote Cryptic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 22:07
Originally posted by Temujin

Soviet Union? China?
Are you sure? 
 
The Soviet Union's perescecution was political in nature and not racial. Russians, Jews, Centeral Asians, Ukrainians, Siberians etc. were never persecuted based on their race, but rather for their real or in most cases, imagined political beliefs.  
 
China....
The majority of the victims of Maoist tyranny were not only of the same racial group as the perscecutors (Han Chinese Asians), but also of the same ethnic group (Han Chinese Asians).  This might be true for the Soviets as well (mostly Russian perscecutors, mostly Russian victims).
 
Sure, there were individual Bolshevick and Maoist rascists, but the focus of the governmental persecution was never racial. Chinese Maoists never even attempted to create a racial definition that would have classified say Tibetans as a seperate "race" and perscecute them for being racially "different".  
Originally posted by Mixcoatl

Originally posted by Cryptic

Even still, it is interesting to note that left wing extremists have not committed medical atrocities on "class enemies".

North Korea does
I can accept this. Though I am not aware of any concrete examples, the North Korean regime is definetly capable of this.


Edited by Cryptic - 08-Sep-2008 at 22:36
Back to Top
Sarmat View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 31-May-2007
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3113 		  Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2008 at 22:27
Yes. Soviet repressions were rather political in nature. Also the main victims of the Soviet terror were Russians by absolute numbers.
Besides it was noticed correctly that a lot of Bolshevik and later Soviet leaders were not ethnically Russians.
In any case nobody was descriminated or prosecuted by the Soviet State just because he belonged to another race. Actually, racism was labeled as "afake theory invented by capitalistic imperialists" in the USSR.
Σαυρομάτης
Back to Top
Husaria View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian
Avatar

Joined: 28-Jul-2008
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 150 		  Quote Husaria Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2008 at 02:03
Yay mass murder is justifiable because it isn't done based on racism?(obviously not but you can't pick up on sarcasm in writing Wink)
Back to Top
Sarmat View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 31-May-2007
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3113 		  Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2008 at 02:18
Almost any kind of murder isn't justifiable. The difference between Nazists and Bolsheviks however was that while Nazists discrimaneted against races, Bolsheviks discriminated against classes. However, in a sense they were almost the same bloody murderers as Nazists.
Σαυρομάτης
Back to Top
Husaria View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian
Avatar

Joined: 28-Jul-2008
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 150 		  Quote Husaria Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2008 at 12:37
I never tried giving the impression that murder was in most circumstances justifiable.  The Nazi vs Bolshevik arguement of who was more morally wrong is a bit pointless the end result is that you got a bunch of bodys. But if i had to choose i would say the Nazi's were worse morally because they treated other races like they were not human. I think the Bolsheviks were still terrible but atleast they targeted people by class not race.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.56a [Free Express Edition]
Copyright ©2001-2009 Web Wiz

This page was generated in 0.078 seconds.