The American/Lebbonese, Helen!

Cryptic, and others, Carol also wrote;

"So the subject of this thread is the Israel and Palestine issue? I am willing to discuss that issue, if doing so is not seen as taking this thread off topic. I would begin with the total outrage of the British using Jews to secure this region for the UK and in general its imperialistic attitude towards indigenous people. I would continue to argue how wrong it was to not give everyone in this region the rights of democracy, when the Palestinians asked for the right, and explain why the Jews strongly opposed a democracy that included the right of the Palestinian vote."

Now, unless every history book I ever read was incorrect, it was the British who opposed the Zionist takeover of Israel, and it was the former Soviet Union that supported them!

If I am wrong, then I have been living in an alternative world for the last 63 years!

The British begin with helping Jews move into the area like colonist.  Although it was France and Ottoman Empire that funded the building the Suez Canal, making Britain a late comer.  Britain bought shares from the Khedive of Egypt, and was glad to settle Jews in the region to secure its control of the region.   Britain also borrowed money from the Rothchilds which it used to supply and train Arabs in a war to throw off the Ottoman Empire's control.   The Brits lead the Arabs to believe they would have control of the region, but they also promised the land for Israel to the Rothchilds and the Zionist dream of a new Israel. 

Edited by Carol - 09-Jul-2010 at 17:28

If I explained everything, I would be writing a book not post small enough for people to read.

Edited by Carol - 10-Jul-2010 at 08:16

 I think if you check this site, you will find some interesting information: http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G2-3424600294.html

Edited by Carol - 10-Jul-2010 at 18:12

Originally posted by Carol The Soviets were involved and continued to be involved.   Joseph Stalin supported Zionism.

Actually the Soviets did arm the Jews, thru its satellite countries and with the black market, etc.! Slovakia, and Czech Rep., reportedly sent large amounts or arms to the Zionists.

But, I cannot now find my sources!

Originally posted by TheGreatSimba Justice and liberty are what we know them to be, they are relative terms, but we can mostly agree on what justice and liberty are. Hitlers idea of justice and liberty was not universal, it was restricted to the "Aryan race". Stalin and Pol Pot did not care about justice or liberty, they were merely power hungry dictators, nothing more. Originally posted by opuslola Now, unless every history book I ever read was incorrect, it was the British who opposed the Zionist takeover of Israel, and it was the former Soviet Union that supported them! If I am wrong, then I have been living in an alternative world for the last 63 years! The British never opposed such an idea, they simply had to also consider the Arab position.

Originally posted by Airhead   Justice and liberty are really important for everyone.  Liberty and justice are defined by our family values, and there is not a big difference in family values.  Educating children how to behave in the right way is very important to maintaining liberty and justice in the world!

This isnt true, justice and liberty are universal terms. Human values are different from family values, different families have different values.

Has it go worse? Or is that just nostalgia? Looking back to some golden age that never really existed. Were the good old days really that good? I for one am immensely sceptical of that particular argument. Is it more the case that we simply recognise and 'fear' different things now? Have our views and priorities changed, in hand with medi hyperbole and scaremongering?

Burgulary, murder, muggings, rape, arson etc etc. None of these are new after all.

Odd how 'the good old days' is a theme consistent in society, social andmoral degredation appear to be a problem recognised by all at different times, each generation has a 'good old days' concept for their past and a dissapointment with the present and future.


Liberty and Justice are highly subjective after all.


As Dara O'Brien once said, the good old days werent really that good, you were just getting more sex, and besides you couldnt turn the light on after dark without the Luftwaffe bombing the shit out of you.

I agree with DreamWeaver, and I think Airhead is making generalizations and assumptions based on his own perceptions or his world view.

Again, I would like to ask Airhead, would you want the United States be a theocracy, like Iran perhaps? History has shown as that religious societies do not work, that is why we developed secularism.