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Hitler and Germans the laughing stock of History

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  Quote IamJoseph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Hitler and Germans the laughing stock of History
    Posted: 20-Oct-2008 at 08:15
they are simply reasserting a phenomenon known as the blood libel: X1 killed Y1 therefore all other Xs are responsible for the action and merit continued condemnation at the hands of the rest of the alphabet.
 
The real truth is even more shocking, but not surprising: those who actually did all the killings, were the same who invented those charges against their victims. They did not just murder one Jesus, but some 2 million of his kin, then went on to make a Protocol styled story by pointing the finger at the Jews for their crimes. This was seen when Nero blamed the Jews for a fire he himself commited, as with the blood libels and with the Protocols. These falsehoods were eagerly accepted - Jews became a suitable scapegoat after the war with Rome and when Israel was seen as dead, bad and none to question if lied against them. Today there is a hell-bent aspiration to wipe the surviving witness from the map, inventing a host of dis-historical paradigms via the UN to achieve this.
 
Today, some 3 billion christians and muslims are totally hijacked by these falsehoods. Truth is, there was never any trial for Jesus, nor was Barabus, who was Rome's most celebrated and prized prisoner, ever offered to replace Jesus and be freed. These stories grew far away from Judea, and was believed by those who knew nothing of that region, and had no way of veryfying them, accepting them via threats, and the premise any who questioned it was subject to the charge of heresy. Millions of forgotten brave people perished at the rake and the sword.
 
 
THE TRUTH WILL SET YOU FREE - IF IT EVER BECOMES ACKNOWLEDGED.


Edited by IamJoseph - 20-Oct-2008 at 08:16
Moses - the First Zionist.
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  Quote IamJoseph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Oct-2008 at 07:55
If one examined medevial Europe's history, and the teachings it perpertrated on its peoples, it will be found to have direct allignments with Nazism. The writings of Luther, for example, are very similar to Hitler's Mein Kampf, with almost direct lift-off verses.
 
However there is little or no truth that the Europeans did not know wht was occuring under nazism. In many states the people assisted the Nazis in masscreing its Jewish populations, especially in Poland, where the first camp was established, with its christian population actively pointing out their Jewish neighbours to the Germans. Considering that European christians had a continious and old history of acting according to the teachings of the church - the 'Ve vere not avare' claim is very weak.  Although there were some brave christians durring the Nazi period, who risked and lost their lives defending the Jews - critical mass applies, and the majority were already beyond changing their minds after centuries of racist teachings.
 
It is a pity that an otherwise brilliant nation like Germany seccumbed to racism, fostered originally and for some 2000 years in so-called emancipated Europe - which was hijacked by the church. During the dark ages, European christianity under church rule was the biggest mass murderer of innocent peoples in all past recorded history, with its charges of deicide, blood libels, the Protocols and other such horrific falsehoods; the crusades, instigated by the church, was only one of these results - but far worse occured inside Europe.
 
Today, Europe is silent of radical islamists emulating these doctrines, and openly  teaching these European falsehoods as real history. There is a full onus on christians to address these falsehoods, because they came from Europe. There is a greater onus on Muslims to address such false and horrible doctrines - it is simply not credible they believe such to be sanctioned by a Godly inclined religion.
 
The correction of these attrocities will benefit Christianity and Islam - and its failure will eventually negate these religions. Truth does not get destroyed, it eventually pops up by itself. Truth is a correction, and the universe is omherently built on truths, which is referred to as correct equations in science and maths. It has become very difficult for christians and muslims to correct these false and racist teachings, because of fear and/or cowardice, and partly because some mistakingly believe them as truths and by alligning such terrible doctrines as being of divine origins.
 
We can see that today, a mass murderous Pope called Pious is to be made a Saint, and as yet there is no fatwah for Bin Laden. What does that say - are all the people free of onus and guilt here that they remain silent of it? It is this very silence which was and is today the cause of all such attrocities. There is only one applicable divine law, or moral truth, which applies:
 
'A FALSEHOOD AND THE HOLY ONE CANNOT ABIDE TOGETHER'
 
'YOU SHALL NOT WITNESS YOUR FELLOWMAN'S INNOCENT BLOOD AND REMAIN IDLE'
 
- This means a religion based on promoting a lie and using it to commit evil - whereby all its adherents remain silent - will definitely be destroyed. This is what occured with Sodom, Ghammorah, and later with Ancient Egypt, Babylon and Mighty Rome.
Moses - the First Zionist.
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  Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Oct-2008 at 15:56
LOL
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  Quote Vorian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Oct-2008 at 14:48
Wow, thread necromancy
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  Quote Goblin Monkey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Oct-2008 at 14:23
Originally posted by longshanks31

on the first day god created britain, he saw that it was good.
The rest was an afterthought



On the first day god created a land mass, farted on it, and made Britan.
Is it just me or did your mom just wink at me?
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  Quote drgonzaga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Dec-2007 at 13:45
Interesting how some would like to perpetuate guilt as a form of Mass Hysteria and forget that in their advocacy they are simply reasserting a phenomenon known as the blood libel: X1 killed Y1 therefore all other Xs are responsible for the action and merit continued condemnation at the hands of the rest of the alphabet. Shades of a Corsican vendetta writ large! If you must blame anyone, blame all of those 19th century thinkers that thought to rationalize life on scientific terms and created scientism. But, such is the negative aspect of the urge to classify and bring order to perceived chaos. Hard to believe the incessant desire to generate bogey men.
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  Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Dec-2007 at 12:54
Originally posted by Temujin

Originally posted by gcle2003

or the massacre at Katyn,


Katyn was comitted by Soviets, not Germans
 
I know. So?
 
Was it a Russian crime? A Soviet crime? Given the makeup of the Soviet Union it could have involved people from lots of different nationalities.
 
I don't think the Germans were the only people to machine-gun civilian refugees, either.
 
That's my point. You don't get out of this particular problem except by specifically identifying the crimes and the criminals.


Edited by gcle2003 - 22-Dec-2007 at 12:56
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  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Dec-2007 at 19:37
Originally posted by gcle2003

or the massacre at Katyn,


Katyn was comitted by Soviets, not Germans
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  Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Dec-2007 at 18:06
As a matter of fact, not all the Nazis committed crimes, so talking about 'Nazi crimes' is as objectionable (if it is objectionable) as talking about 'German crimes'. Moreover not all the crimes committed by Germans in WWII were committed by Nazis.
 
The only way out of the problem would be always to speak only of specific crimes, like the slaughter of the Jews in the death camps, or the massacre at Katyn, or the machine-gunning of civilian refugees.
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  Quote beorna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Dec-2007 at 09:01

Thank you Justinian. There it is. The Germans are not guilty. Hitler was Austrian. So it is all the fault of the Austrians.

Just a joke! And unfortunatel the Austrians are/were Germans. They didn't belong to the German Federation (Deutscher Bund) after 1866 and to the 2nd Reich but that had nothing to do with their ethnicity. After WWII they created a national feeling as Austrians, because they didn't want to be punished like the Germans in the territory of the 3rd Reich.
 
I think it would be a great idea to say the Nazis did all these crimes and not the Germans. But unfortunately the most of them were Germans. So I don't have a problem if you say the Germans did it. This is the cause why I did not like the term Nazi-Germany. They didn't come from Mars or somewhere else. They were elected from a lot of my fellow-citizens, probably (I can't ask them anymore) not from my grandparents, but surely from enough of my other relatives. But the killing was not a pure German phenomenon. There were so many Governments that worked together with the Nazi-Regime (France, Argentina, Finland or Norway, Greece for a short time). There were so many states and people that dealed with Germany (Sweden, Switzerland e.g.; or think of the Bush family. If I rember correct, the grandfather of G.W. made his fortune with Hitler). There were so many supporters of the Nazis abroad (in England, USA e.g.)There were so many Europeans who fought in the SS and there were so many foreigners who served in the concentration camps, there were even an over-average of Austrian and from the Baltic states e.g.
 
We have to discover now, why all these people and states did this, how could this happen, not because we want to blame somebody but because we have to prevent, that such things will happen again.
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  Quote Justinian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Dec-2007 at 03:20
Originally posted by King John

(all of whom were German)
Well, technically the highest of the nazi's was not in fact german.
 
Couldn't resist nitpicking.


Edited by Justinian - 14-Dec-2007 at 03:20
"War is a cowardly escape from the problems of peace."--Thomas Mann

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  Quote Garvm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2007 at 21:26
King John crimes are, sometimes, commited by a country, but not for all citizens of that country.
And, in my opinion, we should identify clearly who commited the crime, and not say that the crime is a german crime, or an american crime, or a russian crime..., but a crime comited by nazis, soldiers, state, robbers, drug dealers, by the american John Doe or by the frenchman Jacques Bonhomme, for example, because identify crimes as something natural of a whole nation is indeed xenophoby...
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  Quote King John Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2007 at 21:08
Originally posted by Garvm

Originally posted by King John

The Nazis who were arrested and tried for war crimes, what nation did they come from? Germany. Making them Germans, therefore one can talk about German crimes. Germans allowed the Nazis to come to power. By the way you should go back and read my other posts where I blame more than just Germans. In fact I blame all who were complicit with the Nazis. Could you please explain how discussing the crimes engineered by the upper echelon of the Nazi party (all of whom were German) promotes xenophobia (hatred or fear) toward Germans?


When you say german crimes instead of nazi crimes, when you are talking about some of the most horrendous crimes in History, is an ofense for all the good Germans that fought (acordingly with their capacities) against Hitler and his minions, and is identifiyng all german nation as criminal, to me this is the most despikable kind of xenophobia: the demonization of all a people...


Try to see this way King John: you certainly consider a crime the abuse over prisioners in Abu Ghraib, you think we should talk about american crimes or american soldiers crimes; one of the statements implies all of a nation (that deserve my respect and esteem) another only the true criminals:some soldiers and oficials of the american army.

You understand now what im trying to say?


Yes I understand what you are trying to say. But you are missing my point. Discussing the crimes of soldiers/government of a country is not the same as xenophobia nor is it demonization. The fact that the American army is made up of Americans allows one to talk about American crimes when discussing crimes committed by the american army.

Will you answer the question that I posed to you? I will repeat it: Why does the discussion of Nazi crimes preclude a discussion of German crimes if the crimes were committed by Germans and for Germany (in some cases)? Countries are capable of committing crimes for instance state sponsored genocide would be a crime that a country commits. No one has demonized the Germans of today for the actions of the Nazis, people might have demonized the Germans living in Nazi Germany but again that's not xenophobia.
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  Quote Garvm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2007 at 19:40
Originally posted by King John

The Nazis who were arrested and tried for war crimes, what nation did they come from? Germany. Making them Germans, therefore one can talk about German crimes. Germans allowed the Nazis to come to power. By the way you should go back and read my other posts where I blame more than just Germans. In fact I blame all who were complicit with the Nazis. Could you please explain how discussing the crimes engineered by the upper echelon of the Nazi party (all of whom were German) promotes xenophobia (hatred or fear) toward Germans?
 
When you say german crimes instead of nazi crimes, when you are talking about some of the most horrendous crimes in History, is an ofense for all the good Germans that fought (acordingly with their capacities) against Hitler and his minions, and is identifiyng all german nation as criminal, to me this is the most despikable kind of xenophobia: the demonization of all a people... 
 
Try to see this way King John: you certainly consider a crime the abuse over prisioners in Abu Ghraib, you think we should talk about american crimes or american soldiers crimes; one of the statements implies all of a nation (that deserve my respect and esteem) another only the true criminals: some soldiers and oficials of the american army.
You understand now what im trying to say?
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  Quote King John Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2007 at 17:04
The Nazis who were arrested and tried for war crimes, what nation did they come from? Germany. Making them Germans, therefore one can talk about German crimes. Germans allowed the Nazis to come to power. By the way you should go back and read my other posts where I blame more than just Germans. In fact I blame all who were complicit with the Nazis. Could you please explain how discussing the crimes engineered by the upper echelon of the Nazi party (all of whom were German) promotes xenophobia (hatred or fear) toward Germans?
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  Quote Garvm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2007 at 09:41
Omg...
Who comited the crimes are the nazis not the Germans.
Nobody can blame the Germans for the WWII crimes, but can blame the nazis for that crimes.
And i think is xenophobia (fear from the other, and hatred also...) brand all Germans for the crimes of only a part of the Germans (and other nacionalities): the nazis (most notably the SS).
My friends... i only try make you understand that we cant blame all a people, because that is unfair to a part of that people (and a type of demonization of the same: that brings xenophobia over them; a thing that Germans experienced the next few years after 1945....) inocent of the crimes.
Is ofensive also for the Germans than fight (and died...) against the nazi regime.
Can be more easy say the Germans commited atrocious crimes against Humanity but isnt true: the Nazis commited atrocious crimes against the Humanity, because more people of others european (and dont only Germans...) countries gave a great help to the nazis (namely joining or actively helping the SS) in the arrest, torture and death of the enemies of the nazi regime.
There are nazis from other countries that join to the most criminal organization of all the SS, from France, Netherlands or USA.
You can understand now why i gave so much importance in clarify that the criminals are nazis and the nacionality is secondary?
.
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  Quote King John Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2007 at 00:32
Originally posted by Garvm

Originally posted by King John

Speaking about german crimes has nothing to do with xenophobia. How is speaking about the crimes of a nation a step toward xenophobia (defined as a hatred or fear of foreigners or strangers or of what is foreign or strange)? These discussions say more about issues people have with governments not necessarily the people of a nation.


Im my opinion speak about the crimes of a people is a kind of hatred toward that people because join inocents and guilties, and indentify all the people as criminal.


Much people tend to put in the same place nazi ciminals and inocents germans, thats why i dont like to talk about german crimes but, instead, i talk about nazi crimes.


I follow the same principle when people talk about the american crimes in Guantanamo: there arent american crimes in Guantanamo but american military crimes...


Wecant blame all by the mistakes of some!


But this isn't xenophobia. Xenophobia would be if somebody said I hate all Germans because of the crimes they committed. However, saying Germans committed crimes during world war II and other times isn't fear nor is it hatred. Therefore it can't be xenophobia since saying Germans committed crimes neither expresses hatred nor fear, it simply states a fact.

Edited by King John - 13-Dec-2007 at 17:05
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  Quote Garvm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Dec-2007 at 21:38
Originally posted by King John

Speaking about german crimes has nothing to do with xenophobia. How is speaking about the crimes of a nation a step toward xenophobia (defined as a hatred or fear of foreigners or strangers or of what is foreign or strange)? These discussions say more about issues people have with governments not necessarily the people of a nation.
 
Im my opinion speak about the crimes of a people is a kind of hatred toward that people because join inocents and guilties, and indentify all the people as criminal.
 
Much people tend to put in the same place nazi ciminals and inocents germans, thats why i dont like to talk about german crimes but, instead, i talk about nazi crimes.
 
I follow the same principle when people talk about the american crimes in Guantanamo: there arent american crimes in Guantanamo but american military crimes...
 
We cant blame all by the mistakes of some!
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  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Dec-2007 at 21:19
When you get a bad government, and it can happen everywhere, you always get an army of followers whether to the left or to the right ready to follow their questionable decisions.
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  Quote King John Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Dec-2007 at 20:56
Speaking about german crimes has nothing to do with xenophobia. How is speaking about the crimes of a nation a step toward xenophobia (defined as a hatred or fear of foreigners or strangers or of what is foreign or strange)? These discussions say more about issues people have with governments not necessarily the people of a nation.
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